Wednesday, 1st April 2026

Hon. Members, there is no quorum. Serjeant-at-Arms, ring the Quorum Bell for 10 minutes.

Serjeant-at-Arms, we do a further five minutes.

Hon. Members, we shall begin the business of the day. Let us have the Leader of the Majority Party. Hon. Pukose, are you stepping in for him?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, on behalf of the Leader of the Majority Party, I beg to lay the following Papers on the Table:

The next Order by the Member for Nandi Hills is deferred.

Next Order.

Hon. Members, this is an ongoing debate. There was no Member on the floor. We will continue. Member for Soy, are you on Order No.9, that is the Universities (Amendment) (No. 5) Bill? I do not know whether the Member for Kesses is preventing you from following the proceedings.

Thank you. It is on the Universities (Amendment) (No. 5) Bill. Simba ni mmoja is busy interrupting me. You will realise that our universities, especially public universities, are facing many difficulties in ensuring they remain afloat and that their management is run to deliver value to our students. It is high time we passed this amendment Bill to address the issues that are bedevilling our universities, especially the bigger public universities.

I am seated with the Member for Kesses here, and there has been a problem at Moi University and in all other public universities. The University of Nairobi and the University of Egerton have the same problems. Most of their problems emanate from management structures. I believe this amendment Bill will address all those issues and ensure that our universities are run professionally.

With that, I support. Thank you.

Hon. Rindikiri, are you on this?

I cannot miss something to say, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I think this Bill is coming at the right time. Why? We have seen many universities facing many financial strains. Some have been investigated for mismanagement. We have cases of admissions. A majority of students are admitted to universities they did not choose. Some students are admitted to private universities, and the Government has not paid some of those universities. For example, the Government owes the Kenya Methodist University close to Ksh2 billion. Many other private universities are facing financial problems because the Government has not released funding.

I think this Bill is coming at the right time because it aims to address financial mismanagement, admission issues, and students being admitted to courses they never applied

for. Students are being admitted and given funding, but universities are not considering the courses they applied for.

I stand to support this amendment Bill. I urge Members, please, to support proper management of universities. I thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Member of Dagoretti North.

Thank you. I also rise to support this Bill. When we dealt with certificates and diplomas way back, we would keep them separate. Why? One, to ensure you have skilled students or Kenyans for job creation. They used to work very closely with a university student. A university student would come in for research and perform the necessary work at a higher level. More importantly, a technical person would implement the research. That is how those two levels would work closely together. I would go straight to a technical school for skills training if I wanted to.

One of the things we have to do now is to avoid duplication between universities and TVETs. If we are building and promoting TVETs, we must have a career path or pathway that creates both. You will realise we need both when you look at CBE today. Nobody will struggle looking for a job. For me, let TVETs handle hands-on skills. It will help universities in resource allocation. There is a need to improve research facilities.

For me, the most important thing is that we are not doing this just for the sake of it. We are trying to ask ourselves how to create a career progression pathway for any child in Kenya. We are just about to clear 8-4-4. Many students are struggling to pass. Let them go to TVETs, then take those who qualify to university to do their degrees. In the end, we shall not penalise or undermine anyone, because each has something to offer the job market.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, when you look at those advanced Asian countries, you realise they have focused more on skills and TVET institutions than on universities. This will help the lecturers to have time to manage students and bring out the best in both sides. Even as we support, I hope it will not again become political, as everyone protects the education sector so much. Look at how we are now struggling with CBE naming. How I wish the Departmental Committee on Education would decide that we have primary, junior and senior schools, so that we can put an end to this ego competition that is about to create a crisis in this very new system we are trying to build.

Again, let us not have universities fighting us on this amendment. Many universities have taken on students for diplomas and certificates due to resource constraints. Most importantly, I hope and pray we can now resolve the model issue and that TVET students receive their resources and scholarships, as those are some of the things they are struggling with. To make it worse, KMTC

is more in line. It is like the TVET for medics. A student who has completed KMTC training can survive in any hospital, even in the rural areas.

We must ask ourselves, all this knowledge we are giving our youth, considering our medical tourism with India, is there a way we can partner with one of those hospitals and take our KMTC students there to learn? There are a billion people there, and they will advance themselves, especially in the imaging area, where we have a big challenge.

In India, the Prime Minister has ensured that anyone who wants to import or export anything must build an industry in the country. They must manufacture that item there to build skills among the people. We are importing many things from China. For the first time, is there a way we can declare that if you want to bring items to Kenya, then you have to set up a manufacturing company here that will employ our youth? This is so that when one is on attachment, they can go straight to an industry to learn those skills.

I support and pray that we do not bring politics into this. Let us agree that we need those two systems to avoid duplication. I beg to support.

Very well. Member for Saku, are you on this one?

Yes. Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to support this Bill on various grounds. First, before the 1980s and 1990s, we had universities, and it was very clear that they offered mostly university degrees. After the 1990s, everything became a university—the Kenya Polytechnic, Kiambu Institute of Science and Technology, Ramogi Institute of Advanced Technology (RIAT) in Nyanza, and Mombasa Polytechnic. The brainbox of this country was the middle-level colleges—people who went to Kenya Power and Lighting Company (KPLC) , KMTCs, and others. They were hands-on, and industries could immediately snatch them and start working on day one.

However, as soon as universities opened their doors and multiplied, they realised they had to cobble together enough money from the population by offering anything and everything under the sun, from certificates to diplomas, and no longer concentrated on degrees. Yes, one can still get a degree or a postgraduate qualification, but the numbers for diplomas and certificates now out-number those for degrees. With that, we are unable to control the quality and standards of education.

Today, we are not surprised when a young boy or girl, supposedly a graduate, is unable to do even the basic things that are expected of them. You may employ a researcher or an economist, but then you ask yourself what they did at the university. By dint of this Bill, we can go back in time and ask where our education system went wrong. Not everyone should pursue a degree. Some should pursue a diploma qualification. In Germany, Great Britain and the United States, there are middle-level institutions where individuals choose not to pursue degrees but opt for other qualifications.

I thank the sponsor of this Bill. Through it, we can regain the middle-level colleges that disappeared. In the form of TVET, we will have those courses and qualifications. However, we must standardise them and ensure the right quality of teaching and academic staff. Those qualifications must not just be certificates and diplomas. They must be rated as world-class so that our youth who qualify are employable worldwide. The issue of universities struggling due to financial constraints can be addressed in other ways, but not by undermining the quality of our education system. The current system, as has been espoused, should now gradually address the thinking that this Bill has put forward.

With those remarks, I beg to support. Thank you.

Very well. Member for Navakholo.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Allow me to support the Universities (Amendment) Bill, which seeks to amend the Act regarding universities offering certificates and diplomas.

Under the Universities Act as it stands today, universities are intended to be institutions that offer higher education and academic research. Research is not just a walk in the park. It is an investment in knowledge and infrastructure that calls for finding business or science- oriented solutions. Certificates in universities are issued to hands-on professionals according to the Technical and Vocational Education and Training (TVET) Act, 2013. Those professionals are supposed to be artisans and consumers of the academic knowledge in those institutions. Therefore, by issuing certificates and diplomas in universities, we are training personnel to be professionals in artisanal workmanship. I would not want to demean any discipline, but if one wants to be a medical engineer, it is better to pursue a degree course rather than a diploma course in a university.

This is a good course of action that will limit universities’ appetite for money. The intention of universities should be to impart knowledge rather than just economic benefits. They are currently driven by the fact that people will pay tuition fees, which demeans the pursuit of knowledge.

What are TVETs doing? There are no plumbers in my constituency. We have built a TVET institute, which is now training plumbers and diploma engineers who can easily go into the field and work. They are meant to deliver hands-on services in their localities. I appreciate the current Government, which is pushing to ensure that every constituency has a TVET institution.

Most of our sons and daughters who have finished Form IV and who got a D, D+ or C- are unable to gain entry into universities for further studies. They should go to TVET institutions to receive training as hands-on professionals for one year, two years or a maximum of three years. They will gain very good knowledge.

I met the Chairperson of the Kenya National Federation of Jua Kali Associations in Kakamega and I was impressed. He told me he was making 2,000 windows. He is not a university graduate. He only has a certificate in welding and is making a very good living from his business. That is the knowledge we need. A graduate mechanical engineer will not be able to compete with that artisan because the artisan has hands-on training. A graduate mechanical engineer has advanced knowledge and can come up with concepts. There is enough room for all of us. We can all enjoy the “cake”. We should share knowledge. A graduate mechanical engineer does not have to do what a diploma holder can do. Training must be specific. The decision by universities to offer technical courses has ruined certain specialties. Diploma holders in computer programming in the 1990s were geniuses who could programme anything under the oversight of graduate computer engineers.

We should embrace this timely Amendment Bill. Our universities should be centres of excellence. We have the National Research Fund (NRF) Kenya which is not being used properly. We should embrace it to allow for comprehensive research. We have Kenyans who are good in research while others are good in politics. We should leave universities to be centres of research and support them in terms of finances.

Look at what happened during the COVID-19 pandemic. Our research institutions were quickly able to assemble and come up with masks through research. They built a factory in Mombasa, which would have been a centre for developing a COVID-19 vaccine to help patients get better. Kenyans are very capable. If supported, Kenya can be the best in the world in terms of research. We should embrace those who are good in academics and keep them in universities. We should not mix the technical and the intellectual fields.

I support the Bill.

Member for Endebess.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me an opportunity to contribute to the Universities (Amendment) Bill. From the onset, I support this amendment Bill, which seeks to stop universities from offering basic certificate and diploma courses and instead allows them to offer post-graduate certificate and diploma courses. Universities should not offer basic certificate and diploma courses. They should not be competing with the middle-level colleges in offering either certificate or diploma courses. One expects to get tutorial fellows, junior lecturers, lecturers and senior lecturers in universities. At that level, it is possible to offer short courses such as postgraduate certificate or diploma courses only to people who already have undergraduate degrees or masters’ degrees.

When universities started offering parallel degree programmes and turned to commercial ventures, they also started offering certificate and diploma courses, which should not be the case. This amendment Bill is cleaning that up and placing universities where they belong. They should offer postgraduate certificate and diploma courses for those who want to do short courses to improve their level of education. Education is a continuous process. Such courses help people to improve on their Continuous Professional Development (CPD) points. Therefore, this amendment Bill is a wise step by the House.

One of the biggest challenges in accessing basic university education is banding. I was at home last week and I met some students who applied for the new university funding model, some of whom are from very poor backgrounds. They were placed in Band 5, and when they appealed, they were moved to Band 4. The Kenya Universities and Colleges Central Placement Service (KUCCPS) need to look into that matter so that such students, who are spread all over the country, can be helped to stay in the university.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, when a student is admitted for a course, for instance in medicine, and he comes from a very poor background, and yet he is placed in band 5, where do you expect him to get money to pay the full school fees? This issue of means testing instrument is still not clearly addressed by the Kenya Universities and Colleges Central Placement Service (KUCCPS). It needs to be looked into so that students do not miss out.

KUCCPS selects students who pursue diploma and certificate courses. It has become a problem. A student is qualified to pursue nursing, laboratory technology or pharmacy, but he is placed to pursue another course such as emergency medicine and other courses. That child is locked into that course and cannot appeal or change it. KUCCPS should look into this so that students are allowed to revise and reapply for the courses they want to do.

These are very serious matters out there. I know each and every Member in this House is faced with similar challenges from constituents. Through the new funding model, they are placed in the wrong band. Others are placed to pursue courses they cannot change by KUCCPS. I appeal to KUCCPS to look into those very weighty matters, so that our students are not disadvantaged in acquiring education and advancing their careers.

With those few remarks, I support the Bill.

Very well. Member for Sigowet/Soin, Hon. Justice Kemei.

Hon. Justice Kemei (Sigowet/Soin, UDA) : Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to add my voice to this very critical Bill. At the outset, I register my support for this Bill, which has come at the right time.

We must admit that as a nation, we made a mistake by scrapping our technical institutions in favour of the proliferation of universities. While I agree entirely that we must expand university education in this country, we cannot do so to the detriment of technical education or middle-level education.

I join my colleagues in saying that universities should provide higher learning and do research that we, as a human race, need. Certificates and diplomas should be left to middle-level colleges. It was sad to see us converting our teachers’ training colleges into universities. It was sad to see Kenya Science Teachers’ College being watered-down from what it was doing previously. I do not want to say what my colleagues have said. Universities in this country must confine themselves to offering degrees and post-graduate diplomas in their areas of specialisation.

Secondly, our universities can link their programmes with universities in other parts of the world. If a student in this country graduates from the University of Nairobi, he can compete for job opportunities with a student from Harvard University. Doing so will ensure that the students who graduate here can migrate to other parts of the world and work there. When I attended the School of Journalism, the programme we studied was linked to studies in Eastern Europe. That meant that if I graduated from communication school in Kenya, I would be competent enough to work with someone who had graduated from a university in Eastern Europe. That way, we will make sure that any student who graduates here can work in any part of the world.

Hon. (Dr) Pukose has spoken about KUCCPS. I do not want to repeat what he has said. The cry of our people is that they must be allowed to pursue courses of their choice. Revision of courses must be transparent and fair to students who wish to change.

Finally, universities and all other colleges should link their training with the industrial requirements of this country. For example, if an industry producing plastics requires certain skills, then our universities must align their curriculum to those requirements. If agriculture requires irrigation technology, then universities must train students in irrigation technology or biotechnology to increase agricultural productivity in this country.

With those remarks, I support the Bill. Thank you.

Very well. Member for Nyeri Town, do you want to contribute to this Bill?

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I have looked at this Bill. It seeks to bar universities from offering ordinary diplomas and certificates. The Commission for University Education (CUE) retains its role as the competent authority on postgraduate certificates, diplomas and degrees. Which is the competent authority to handle middle-level training? We have the Technical and Vocational Education and Training Authority which is in charge of technical and vocational training. Which is the authority in charge of business training, accounting, nursing and the many other middle-level competencies our country needs? I wonder whether this Bill should be improved to bring more coherence by establishing one authority on qualifications in this country.

We have the Kenya National Qualifications Authority somewhere in the framework. Does banning universities from offering ordinary diplomas and certificates open the field for every Tom, Dick and Harry to establish training institutions without reporting to any authority? That requirement is not there. Kenyans are being subjected to all kinds of trainings in this country. Allow me to give an example of a training that is very popular in institutions in the country referred to as a nurse assistant. This title is not recognised in human resource for health both in the policy and strategic plan. Our children and their parents are being exploited by institutions that are coming up with fancy titles.

As legislators, we must ask ourselves whether in enacting laws, we should look at an industry holistically from end to end. Therefore, while I support barring universities from offering certificates and diplomas, I would like this Bill or a partner Bill to bring clarity to tertiary and middle-level training in our country. Hon. Temporary Speaker, there is also this other question of Higher Education Loans Board (HELB) . What is higher education? Once we move from basic education, what is the next level? Why does every child in this country, after their basic education, who goes to the next level of training, not qualify to be funded by HELB? People say HELB is a brainchild of the Ministry of Education. Teacher trainees in Kamwenja, Kagumo and Murang’a Teachers Colleges, under the Ministry of Education, do not qualify for funding under higher education. Why, yet those are Kenyan children?

For the students at the Kenya Medical Training College (KMTC) , the Ministry of Health is asked to find funds to be administered by HELB for higher education. Yet, everybody under TVET apparently qualifies for higher education funding. We need to be more coherent as a House in terms of a holistic appraisal of the regulation of the education sector. Therefore, while I support this, I urge us, as legislators, including myself, to bring more clarity to the area of education, and especially the equal treatment of every Kenyan child who accesses higher education. If the word “higher” is misleading, then we need to rename HELB so that it provides educational support to those children, for whom we provide bursaries under basic education but, immediately thereafter, there is a huge gap. For example, I support a child who is at KMTC with Ksh7,000 and yet, the fee is Ksh70,000. How do parents raise the remainder and yet, we do not have dedicated funding for such children under HELB?

With those comments, I support.

Member for Nandi Hills.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to contribute to this very timely Bill that has been sponsored by Mejjadonk Benjamin Gathiru, Member for Embakasi.

At the outset, I support the Bill. As a country, we have matured enough to streamline some of those institutions. They have done well in the past, but it makes it better when we streamline their functions and make them more effective. By separating the degree courses in our country from diplomas and certificates in a more organised manner, it is the right thing to do for posterity.

This Bill, in the abstract, when I see the amendment of Section 5, where it gives the functions of the Commission on University Education for them to equate postgraduate certificates and diplomas done in foreign universities, and marrying that to the amendment of Section 70, which then demands of the Commission to provide regulations on the procedure of equating those postgraduate diplomas and certificates, it is the right thing to do and for that, I sincerely appreciate.

Now, coming back and putting the Technical and Vocational Education and Training Authority to handle the aspects of diplomas and certificates, my concern now comes in: Does it cover all courses, up to and including those like business, diplomas, business administration and those kinds of things? I agree with some of my colleagues who have shared that, if the degree courses have been benchmarked at the CUE, then we need to have a holistic authority that handles all courses that relate to diplomas and certificates, not only vocational. On the aspect of providing for the ongoing students, so that they will not be interrupted with the courses they are doing, it is very good and timely, so that they can have the comfort of finishing the training they are going through without interruption.

However, I also want to give a proposal for the sponsor of this Bill to consider. Universities have invested a lot, and they were making a lot of money by having those diploma courses within their institutions. Is it also possible, because most of them have invested, probably building laboratories and workshops where they were able to handle some of those diploma courses, that even though CUE will be handling the issue of recruitment, technical colleges can still work in partnership with the institutions that have put in a lot of investment, using Government money and public funds, to put up some of those facilities to train students? That they can still utilise those facilities so that there is no waste of the investment made in their institutions.

The fact that the placement boards have now been mandated to ensure that there shall be no placement of any students undertaking diplomas and certificates in universities is good, because it provides direction. But there must be a window for utilising the infrastructure that has already been put in place in those universities in the past, because they should not be left as white elephant projects, given the funds that have been used in those places. Overall, it is timely. It is the right thing to do and progressive, and I therefore support it wholeheartedly, save for those proposals that I have already put in place.

Thank you.

Very well. Member for Marsabit, Hon. Waqo. She has stepped out. I do not see more interest in this Bill. The Mover will reply at the next appointed time.

Next Order.

Hon. Rahim is not in the House. This will be deferred.

(Bill deferred) Next Order.

The Mover of this Bill is Hon. Tom Anthony Oluoch. He is not in the House. It will be deferred to the next sitting. Next Order.

Similarly, it is by the Member for Mathare. It will be deferred to the next appointed sitting. Next Order.

This is by Hon. Oku Kaunya. He is in the House. Are you ready to move?

You have the Floor to do so.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I beg to move that the National Police Service (Amendment) Bill, (National Assembly Bill No. 39 of 2025) , be now read a Second Time.

The Bill was read a First Time on Wednesday, 24th September 2025 and was committed to the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security for consideration and reporting in accordance with Standing Order 127.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, the purpose of this Bill is straightforward. It seeks to amend the National Police Service Act to introduce an upper-age limit of 60 years for persons appointed as inspector-general and deputy inspector-general of police. It also seeks to provide clarity in the tenure of the deputy inspector-general by introducing a one-term limit of five years, an area where the law is currently silent.

This Bill is important because those are not ordinary officers. The IG and the DIG carry immense responsibility. They are required to make quick, high-stake decisions, respond to complex security challenges and provide steady leadership in the entire National Police Service (NPS) . Those roles demand experience and a high level of physical and mental resilience. The Bill, therefore, seeks to ensure that those entrusted with such responsibility, are able to meet

those demands and, at the same time, allow room for succession planning and renewal within the service.

Article 245 of the Constitution establishes the Office of the IG who is appointed by the President with the approval of Parliament for a single term of four years, and is not eligible for re-appointment. The Constitution also provides that each of the two police services, that is the Administration Police Service (APS) and the NPS, shall be headed by a DIG appointed by the President on recommendation of the National Police Service Commission. However, neither the Constitution nor the National Police Service Act sets out a clear term limit for the DIG. In practice, they often serve based on contractual terms, usually around five years, unless they are removed in accordance with the law. The Bill, therefore, seeks to provide a clear and predictable framework for the tenure of the DIG.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, it is worth noting that the IG and DIG are State officers. Generally, State officers do not have a fixed retirement age. However, our law recognises that for certain critical offices, limits are necessary to promote efficiency, accountability and orderly transition in leadership. For example, judges retire at 70 years with an option of 65. The Chief Justice serves for a maximum of 10 years or until retirement, whichever comes earlier. Similarly, within the Kenya Defence Forces, the Chief of the Defence Forces and Service Commanders serve for a single term of four years or retire upon attaining the mandatory retirement age, whichever comes first. This has helped ensure predictability and smooth succession at the highest levels of command. Comparative experience from other jurisdictions also points in the same direction.

The retirement age for members of South African Police Service including the National Commissioner, is 60 years. In India, every government servant, including the Director-General of Police, retires upon attaining the age of 60 years. Those examples show that setting an age limit for top police leadership is not unusual. Rather, it is consistent with global practice.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I wish to clarify that this Bill is not intended to target the current holders of the office. It is a policy measure meant to strengthen the institutional framework of the NPS. If enacted, it will apply prospectively and will not affect the current holders of the office necessarily, especially the IG and DIG. The Constitution itself protects the four-year term, which the IG serves, and the protection remains untouched. This Bill is about ensuring strong, effective and forward-looking leadership of the Police Service. It seeks to balance the value of experience with a need for renewal and provide clarity where the law is currently silent.

With those few remarks, I beg to move and request Hon. Raso to second. Thank you.

Member for Saku.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to second this very important Bill. For a long time, issues concerning NPS have not been addressed, particularly the length of service and different senior appointments. When the Committee looked at this Bill, we were trying to resolve what we consider to be unchartered waters. Previously, many were afraid to address what has remained contentious within the NPS.

This Bill addresses the fundamental issues of morale and predictability of promotion of different individuals. We have seen cases where the IG or the DIG are brought from elsewhere to serve at the helm of the NPS. This has created a tendency to undermine morale, commitment and judicious service to this nation by those very professional officers. This Bill addresses and clarifies grey areas that were not captured in the original National Police Service Act of 2012. Having come from the KDF, it is a very stable institution, but also a clear bureaucracy, because they have laid down the hierarchy of when individuals can be promoted. If they do not get promoted, what happens to them? They leave the service. When can one be appointed the Chief of the Defence Forces? More often than not, they should be a serving service commander from

the Kenya Navy, Kenya Air Force or the Kenya Army. I must thank Hon. Oku Kaunya. We have attempted to bring clarity that somebody who will be an IG is likely to be someone who has been head of the General Service Unit (GSU), AP or the KPS. That way, anybody who is serving in the police at the senior rank knows that they are heading to the very top without any ambiguity.

On the issue of correction in terms of age limit, even in the last appointment of the IG, there were people who said that he was above the required age limit. As a Committee, when we looked through the existing laws and it came out clearly that nothing had been stipulated on the same, in the absence of an existing law, then you follow the Constitution. Does it lay out anything? The Constitution is mute on that part. For that reason, I agree with my colleague that this law will not affect the serving DIGs and IG. Going forward, those who are likely to succeed the exiting IG, because this is about succession within the NPS, then individuals will know that, as an AIG, they are likely to succeed their superiors in the following promotions.

Finally, this issue of not addressing some of the factors that undermine the good order and bureaucracy of the NPS is a cause of corruption. Individuals may be buying their way to the top by approaching politicians. If what is in law is not muted; and there is clarity and no ambiguity or middle ground, then individuals are going to stay on their lane, work their way up the ladder to be able to command the NPS.

The age limit of 60 years that Hon. Oku Kaunya alluded to was never mentioned within the Act before now. The compulsory retirement age of DIGs and IGs, and how long they will serve was never mentioned too. Through this Bill, we have come up with a very clear position; that the IG serves for four years and serves through his time, but he will be appointed before he reaches the age of 60. If that individual reaches the age of 60, he or she will not be appointed as IG or DIG. The DIGs are going to serve for a term of five years non-renewable. Anybody who will be appointed to those two very important offices in the NPS are long-serving individuals who are professionally qualified to occupy those offices.

With those remarks, I beg to second and ask the House to support this Bill. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Very well.

Hon. Members, the Report and the Bill are with the Clerks-at-the-Table. Before we start the debate, allow me to recognise, in the Speaker’s Gallery, students and teachers from Mutungoni Academy in Mavoko Constituency, Machakos County. You are welcome to the House to observe the proceedings as they unfold.

The first chance will go to the Member for Seme Constituency, Hon. Nyikal.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to support this Bill. In maintenance of law and order and the whole issue of governance and integrity, there are two critical institutions: The NPS and the Judicial Service Commission (JSC) . If those two do not work or there are doubts in their performance, all other efforts amount to nothing. Therefore, this Bill seeks to be very clear on how the IG and the DIG are appointed and this is extremely important. It removes any doubt. It is very clear on who can be appointed and who cannot. We are used to people lobbying. Therefore, even if they lobby, they will only do so if they qualify for the job. This is because the Bill has stated clearly that they must have experience, the kind of jobs they have held and the qualifications that they have. Therefore, that part is extremely important.

The other thing is the term limit. It is also very clear how long they will serve. Again, that means that once somebody is in office, they can plan on how long they are going to serve and the changes they are going to make so that there would be enough time to work on it.

Secondly, it will also bring confidence because in the forces, people grow by the ranks. They would like to know that if they moved in a particular direction by this time, they can get there. If it is not clear how long people are going to stay in office and is left in the vulgarism of politics and other issues, the officers lose morale. As I said earlier, there is nothing worse for the police force and JSC when people feel that there is no future for them in the service. That, however hard they work, they will not get anywhere. When people get to that level of ‘I do not care attitude’, the suffering is great. Hon. Temporary Speaker, we can talk about integrity and corruption but, if those two institutions, NPS and JSC, do not work, all is lost.

Therefore, this Bill comes at an appropriate time. It has set out who should or not be appointed. It has set out the term limit and indicated why you cannot become an IG. Probably, what is not here, that we will have to look at it seriously in the whole of the NPS, is the progression of people. If again at the lower-levels people do not progress as designed in time so that many people also reach the limit before they get there, another despondence will come where people know that they can delay. When they get to 58 or 59 years of age and they know they are still stuck down, even as early as 50 years, and they see other people ahead of them. Knowing that there is a line ahead of them, then you are going to see despondence and people not working in life.

With that, I support the Bill. However, I think we will look at the structure of the NPS. In the Armed Forces, I think they have managed to make sure that at every stage, you can stay at that stage for just a fixed period. That means you move quickly. Therefore, people are hopeful that they can get to the top and their movement at lower stages and it is also timed. If we only time and put the limit at the top, we are likely to have chaos in the lower cadres if the movement is not equally coordinated.

With that, Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support this Bill.

Hon. Rindikiri.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I join my colleagues to support this Bill. It has been a practise for civil servants to retire at 60 years. On that basis, we must align the NPS with the same requirement. I disagree with the statement that someone who is 60 years old has no stamina. That is totally out of order, and I hope Hon. Kaunya is listening!

Hon. Kaunya, you are being alerted on your statement.

His statement was that people who are aged 60 years and above are not physically fit. I do not know the criteria he used to come up with that information.

Secondly, it is obvious that the older people are more experienced than the younger ones. The two criteria he brought in as reasons why the retirement age should be 60 are invalid, unless he tells us the basis of that. For instance, Hon. Nyikal is physically fit and yet, he is approaching 70 years. We should also consider individual experience and capacity to perform. Thirdly, the Bill proposes that the DIG serve for a five-year term. This means that if I were to become the DIG at 54 and serve for five years, by the time my term is over, I would be 59. Would that mean I go home? In such a case, I should be allowed to continue serving or move to the Inspector-General rank until I hit 60. Many people will find themselves in such situations, which should be reconsidered.

One of the things that demoralises the NPS is their career path. Once one joins the Police as a constable, there needs to be a very clear outline of how long they will serve as a constable and the requirements for moving up the career ladder. Many graduates who joined as constables take so long to get to the commissioned ranks, which is not right. When amending this Act, we need to consider the growth of young people who have chosen to join the Police as a career. They cannot be retained as constables until retirement. That is very unfair,

considering that some who scored a D plain are moving up faster than those who went to university.

You find people at DIG levels who have no papers and yet, younger officers have them. Educational qualifications should be included as a requirement to climb the ladder. We should not only talk about age. Some issues need to be corrected in Kenya, and this is one of them. We cannot be preparing a position for specific people. We are making the law for posterity. We want to ensure that everyone has an opportunity. For us to abide by the rule of law, we need equal criteria.

The positions of the IG and the DIG should not be political appointments. They are not the same as those of cabinet secretaries. Those are people who have progressively grown within the ranks. I also agree with what Hon. Nyikal said earlier. People from other forces, indeed, join the NPS. They transition from the KDF to join KPS and NPS, but the opposite never happens. Let us be fair to the NPS by doing the right thing. Passing this law will create confidence and motivation for our young people to choose a career in the NPS.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Member for Navakholo.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, at the outset, allow me to support this Bill by the great Member for Teso North. Allow me to inform the House that the Member for Teso North was a career police officer, or rather a public servant who has served in the administrative side. He has brought such a Bill because he understands. He is doing this out of what he might have gone through before joining the National Assembly. Therefore, I take this with lots of regard and concern. It is a good Bill.

The Bill seeks to mainly look at two issues: The age limit of the retirement of the IG, which is not provided for under either the Constitution or the National Police Service Act and the term limit of the DIG. The Act is not going to be superior to the Constitution. The Constitution provides for the term of office for the IG as four years and, therefore, any person in that office will not be interrupted by virtue of us passing this Bill into law. The current IG should not be a subject of discussion. However, any other person who will be coming on board will be bound by the law to retire at 60.

The proposal to have the DIG serve for five years is a good thing since it was not provided for in the National Police Service Act. By proposing the DIG to serve for five years, we will have sorted that. Comparing the years the IG and the DIG will serve, and assuming they are appointed on the same day, since the IG is supposed to serve for four years, during the succession, the one-year overlap will cushion the NPS so that at no point will the position of the IG be vacant. One year is sufficient for the relevant authority to appoint the next IG.

Apart from the two issues we aim to address about the National Police Service Commission, we also need to look at the infrastructure issue. Why are we allowing our officers to operate without any equipment of trade? They do not have vehicles to move around and, for those who have them, they are forced to share. A case in point is what the Navakholo Officer Commanding Police Division (OCPD) is experiencing. He does not have a car. He uses the one for the Administration Police. That means that, at some point, they share the vehicle with the Officer Commanding Station (OCS) . If the OCS is using the vehicle, my OCPD has no vehicle.

As we look at the bigger offices, let us also look at where the rubber meets the road, and it is at the station. We need to empower our officers at the station to have the relevant tools of trade, such as vehicles. They should also be supplied with the infrastructure to move at night. A while back, there was a rumour at the Kenya Prisons Service that kits used by prison officers during pass-out parades were not enough. It is alleged that they had to bring on board uniforms from the serving officers. We are duty-bound to fund the National Police Service Commission, the NPS and the KPS so that, at least, we have enough officers working in a conducive environment.

This Bill introduces provisions allowing persons from outside the Service to be appointed. Allow me to join Hon. Nyikal and state that, at the appropriate time, an amendment should be proposed so that we only have officers within the relevant services attaining the high ranks. Let us not introduce persons from external bodies to head those institutions. Why should we go out to source for people when we have senior deputy inspector-generals of police who have served and can rise to become inspector-generals? Let us grow the Service. Let every officer who joins the Police Service at the level of constable know that at one time, he or she can rise to the highest rank. There must always be competition to achieve and attain one’s aspirations.

Any Member joining this House aspires to be the President of this county, the apex of political administration. Therefore, it is important that officers joining as constables like those in the Armed Forces who know that they can rise to become the Chief of General Staff, a decorated four-star general, they can also rise to become Inspector-General of Police. Let us not introduce persons from outside to take positions that ought to taken-up by persons who have served in those services.

I feel this is a good Bill. I urge my colleagues to support it. I also thank the President and the Government for adding something in the pockets of police officers. It may not be sufficient—nothing is ever sufficient—but something is better than nothing. We encourage the Government to continue looking into the welfare of police officers so that they can work well and work for Kenyans.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I support the Bill.

Member for Kiambaa. I can see you have killed the kamukunji for Kiambu.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I was consulting with different Members depending on their seniority in the National Assembly. Allow me to take this opportunity to support the Hon. Member who has moved this Bill.

There are issues that we need to address even as we support it. One of them is the requirement of 15 years of experience. What has killed much of the Civil Service is the existence of loopholes that prevent career officers from progressing within their professions where State appointments are made by the President. We must find a way to protect career civil servants, especially those who have been serving in those specific institutions.

The requirement of 15 years of experience is a small part. We should say that one must have served in the Police Service from as low as a sergeant or inspector so that he or she can grow through the ranks of the Service. At the end of the day, we want someone who is experienced and knows where Baragoi is. We want someone who has risen through the ranks starting as a junior officer and promoted on merit and not because he or she knows somebody in the Government or have rubbed shoulders with certain Members of Parliament or governors. They should be people who have given their all in their careers.

I will talk to the Hon. Member about the amendment. Fifteen years is such a short time. It should be 30 or even 35 years of experience so that the person who is put in charge of security has served in the Kenya Police Service, has risen through the ranks and served as an Officer Commanding Station (OCS) , Officer Commanding Police Division (OCPD) , a Sub-County

Police Commander and a County Police Commander gaining experience in the system. When such a person is appointed to the top seat, he or she understands what happens in the smallest police post. If they are told that there is a challenge of thieves because of lack of motor vehicles, they can relate to what is going on.

I have seen cases where people who have been out of the country applying for the jobs because we have set the bar very low. We only require 15 years of experience, qualifications in law, criminology or sociology, but that is entirely different from the day-to-day activities in the security sector of the Republic. We must protect and entice police officers by ensuring that if they serve genuinely and honestly, they can rise through the ranks to become the Inspector- General of Police without knowing anyone. Currently, we are killing the morale especially of career civil servants.

The other day, an advertisement for the Kenya Revenue Authority commissioners was done and people who do not know anything about revenue collection or its challenges may be appointed to the helm of KRA. One must understand the system before becoming a Cabinet Secretary or a Chief Executive Officer. If such a person is given a target, he or she knows the model to apply.

When police officers have experience of serving at the border, in Garissa or Wajir, when challenges arise, they understand what is going on within the Republic. However, we are probably appointing people who have no clue where Wajir or Kiambaa is because they have never served there. They have never moved from one area to another.

We must raise the bar and protect career progression among civil servants. Police officers who have served as sergeants and risen through the ranks should be appointed on merit to become the Inspector-General of Police. As this Bill progresses, we will propose amendments to protect those who have served within the National Police Service.

I agree that where retirement comes first, an officer appointed as Inspector-General should go home. Leaders should ensure that they have raised another generation to take over after them. No individual has the monopoly of experience. If an officer is appointed close to retirement age, for example, two years to retirement, they should retire if it is the age of retirement that comes first. This is the model that is used in other arms of Government, including the Judiciary and the Kenya Defence Forces. Why should it not be used in the National Police Service? An individual cannot tell us that he is the only one who has the experience to manage security. Suppose the person dies! Does it mean we will not have another Inspector-General of Police? Therefore, whichever comes first, retirement or completion of term, should apply. If one is supposed to serve for one term as Inspector-General of Police and you take over at 59 years, one should go home so that we appoint another Inspector-General of Police and Deputy Inspector-General of Police.

My key concern is that we must protect career civil servants and encourage them while they serve the Government and offer almost their entire lives. People say appointments are on merit but most times, for one to get certain positions, you must know certain people in this country. We must protect career civil servants so that when there are vacant positions, they only need to present their curriculum vitaes without knowing anyone in this country.

There are many issues that the National Police Service needs to address. Members have mentioned some of them. The performance of security has other attributes like facilitation of vehicles for ease of movement. We are approaching the election period. The police usually lack enough vehicles to ease their movement in ensuring elections are conducted smoothly, as well as fighting criminals and Al-Shabaab.

The Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security is my witness that we have been setting aside a budget for modernisation. I sit in the Budget and Appropriations Committee. We have been setting aside money for modernisation in every budget cycle. We want to know from the Departmental Committee on Administration and

Internal Security what that modernisation money is doing. It is a sensitive matter to discuss. We must also know whether the police are being modernised.

I have not seen anything modernised as far as my constituency is concerned. Not guns, walkie-talkies or even vehicles and yet, we have been setting aside money for modernisation every single year. We need to understand whether the police are well equipped and facilitated. I appreciate what the Government did the other day by increasing their salaries. Motivation goes a long way as well as letting them know they matter as they continue fighting for this country and doing what is right.

We must protect them and make them understand that one is entitled to apply for a job or position when it becomes vacant as long as he or she has 30 years of experience as a police officer. Furthermore, one will get that opportunity because of merit.

I support.

Thank you, Hon. Kawanjiku. Hon. Maina Mathenge, Member of Nyeri Town.

Thank you. I stand to support the Bill. However, while the idea of protecting career police officers and opening space for younger ones is good, how does this Bill strengthen accountability and eliminate corruption within the Police Force? I wish this Bill had something in that line.

The Traffic Police Department within the National Police Service (NPS) is always ranked highest when the public service is being ranked. I wonder why we should not introduce the position of a Deputy Inspector-General (DIG) to handle traffic police specifically. Would it bring better performance, especially in light of increasing road accidents and the loss of lives? It is attributed to, although not wholly, to the state of the vehicles that are offering public services and private vehicles. Yet, there is a requirement of motor vehicle inspection. Again, licensing is a component of traffic police.

There is illicit alcohol that is killing our country and generations. Hon. Kaunya, could we possibly expand this to introduce a specialised unit within NPS to deal with the menace of illicit alcohol across our country? It is damaging our young people, ruining families, and ruining lives at a very high cost.

Order, Hon. Mathenge. As the sponsor of this Bill, Hon. Oku Kaunya has a lot of experience in the Police Service. If you wish, you can take the opportunity to fill in your colleagues. You can do that if you want. I have perused the Bill and I have a feeling that most of the issues he is raising are already taken care of in the Act or also in this Bill. Therefore, there is no problem if you want to do so or wish to do it as you respond.

You may proceed, Hon. Mathenge.

Thank you. I am aware that the Bill is looking at enforcing retirement age as generally agreed under the Public Service and allowing continuity between the position of the Inspector-General (IG) and the Deputy Inspector- General (DIG) upon the position of the IG falling vacant. However, this is the top leadership of the Police Force. We cannot examine the occupation of that position without looking at the performance and delivery of the units and powers the two positions of IG and DIG are superintending.

In a shopping centre known as Gatitu in my constituency, I have five brands of alcohol that have all been tested by the Kenya Bureau of Standards (KEBS) , the Anti-Counterfeit Authority (ACA) , and the Government Chemist under the Public Health Act. They have been found unsuitable for public consumption and yet, we have a law that is being enforced. Should I blame the local police station or go all the way up to the position of the IG and DIG, which is the subject of our conversation here today?

Therefore, the laws we are making and the amendments to the existing laws must also result in amendments that are more responsive to the issues affecting our people. I will be constrained to want to speak about the IG and the DIG and yet, the samples that were collected from bars in Gatitu—Best Gin, Diamond Ice, Sweet Berry, Dana's Brandy and Jambo Ice—are killing people in my constituency. We have the Alcoholic Drinks Control Act of 2010 that the police headed by the IG and the two DIGs are supposed to enforce.

Two manufacturers are manufacturing those brands. How come the East African Breweries Limited (EABL) requires all empty bottles to be returned to the manufacturer and yet, the manufacturers of those other alcohol brands that are bottled in their branded bottles are killing our people, do not see it necessary for the bottles to be returned?

I urge Hon. Kaunya to consider whether it is possible to introduce further amendments so that we can also strengthen service delivery for Kenyan citizens as we look at the leadership. We are heading to a point where, despite those positions being there, Kenyans are feeling more and more helpless. They feel like the duty bearers have abandoned them and that there will be a tendency for people to want to protect them. Yes, we have constitutional structures with powers and mandate to protect our society. Therefore, we cannot just sit here and only speak about our positions and other senior positions.

I request Hon. Kaunya to kindly consider my statements in the final Bill and see whether it is possible to strengthen the performance of the Police Service in our country, especially in responding to road accidents and illicit alcohol in our country.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I support.

Thank you very much, Hon. Mathenge. Hon. Francis Sigei, Member for Sotik.

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to also add my voice to this Bill. At the outset, I support the Bill. First, I acknowledge that the sponsor of this Bill is a man of integrity. He is a man who has served this country and understands the security apparatus of this country. Therefore, when somebody of his calibre brings such an amendment, he understands. In this country, the role of the Kenya Police Service is so crucial that whatever people are talking about always centres on the way the police are operating. This amendment is following the footsteps of the Tonje Rules. The Tonje Rules in this country brought some kind of revolutionary measures which are now making the Kenya Defence Forces a very stable institution. Therefore, when the Member from Teso North brings in this amendment, it does not mean that it is the end of everything. We have the Maraga Reforms which have a raft of measures that are trying to improve the Kenya Police Service.

I commend Hon. Kaunya. When we talk about the age limit, we are not targeting a particular officer. This is a recommendation for the posterity of the Kenya Police Service. Therefore, when we talk about the age limit, we are looking at those people who are also coming up the ranks. There are officers down there who have been in service for many years and have not been promoted. Those are the frustrations that the officers are facing in this country. Therefore, when we open up the positions at the top, there will be hope for those officers in the lower ranks, especially in the General Service Unit.

We also have what I would call a grey area—the issue of graduates joining the Kenya Police. Graduates are facing many challenges and we need to look at this amendment in that respect. I want to say this amendment Bill is progressive and it addresses matters that will assist the Kenya Police.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, the morale of officers in the lower ranks is causing a lot of problems. If an officer remains a constable for 15 years without hope, it creates frustration. That is why you see a lot of corruption in this country because officers do not see any hope in the future. Therefore, I appeal to this House, especially through the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security, to allocate more resources so that officers can be more

effective. In many places across the country, police ask citizens to fuel vehicles to respond to emergencies. That creates serious problems. We need a well-resourced Kenya Police Service and officers with high morale.

On housing, there was a policy requiring officers to live outside the station. That was a mistake. It should be revised so that officers can live within their stations and can respond quickly to emergencies in the said areas. This amendment is timely, and those who have served in Government for a long time understand its importance.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

What is out of order, Member for Kisii? I will give you back your two minutes, Hon. Sigei.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. As we continue debating on matters to do with the police, I saw the beautiful students from Mutonguni leaving. I did not want them to go before I contributed. That is why I have interrupted. My daughter is in that school.

You may take your seat. I will give you a chance to contribute. There is nothing out of order. I do not have any power to ask them to stay, but you will have a chance in the next three minutes. Member for Sotik, please, conclude!

Hon. Temporary Speaker, that was a point of information where the Member was concerned regarding the students who are leaving. I will conclude.

Who do you want to inform, Member for Sotik?

I was referring to the Member who interrupted me.

I need to ask her whether she would like to be informed by you. Member for Kisii, would you like to be informed?

No! I was just concerned.

In that case, Member for Sotik, you have two minutes. Conclude, please.

I want to conclude by saying that the Kenya Police Service plays a crucial role and this House must support it by allocating more resources, giving them better housing and looking at the issue of promotions so that we do not have the issue of corruption. Corruption is a major problem in this country and it must be addressed within the service. The Maraga Reforms are progressive and Members of Parliament must look at them because it is a big thing which is coming up that this Government is implementing.

Thank you.

Thank you. The Member for Kisii County, proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. It is high time we made reforms in the Police Service. They carry a heavy workload without proper balance or ratio. In other countries, one or two officers serve about 100 civilians. Here, officers are overwhelmed due to the magnitude of their work. Their work should balance and there must be a proper ratio. Just like in schools where we consider the teacher-student ratio, the same should be factored in the Police Service. That is why I felt that I needed to speak before the students leave. Teachers need manageable class sizes, not to have like 100 learners per teacher. When the Junior Secondary School (JSS) was started, there was a lot of noise as the teacher-student ratio was not balancing.

In that view, allow me to welcome Mutonguni students. They look smart. Girls and boys, work hard. I see it is a mixed school. Please, reduce sharing of love notes in class. You

can be spiritual by reading more bible verses and encourage one another. To the teachers of Mutonguni, karibuni sana to Parliament. My daughter has decided to behave well. I cannot see her smiling. She is my duplicate. She even campaigned for me in 2022 in her school. Follow the good examples of your mother and aim to be the next leader.

Thank you.

Hon. Esther Passaris, Member for Nairobi City County.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the National Police Service (Amendment) Bill, 2025, which seeks to primarily address the issue of retirement, which was not adequately captured in the original Act. Acts of Parliament are not cast in stone and must continuously be amended. This amendment Bill will help us to strengthen our Police Force.

We often see people criticising the Police Force based on their response during demonstrations. We cannot do without the police. A nation without a police force would descend into total anarchy. We must respect the police and the work that they are mandated to do.

There are many cross-cutting challenges not only for the Police Force, but also for the citizens of Nairobi County. I am pleased to note some positive developments. For instance, during a recent visit to the Central Bank of Kenya, we saw the quality housing provided for the officers who are assigned to the institution.

Similarly, through the Housing Levy, we will be able to provide institutional housing and hostels for students. It is critical that we allocate more resources to the police, particularly for training. When we are considering budget cuts, the police budget should not be among those that are reduced.

As we create job opportunities, we should also focus on increasing the number of police officers. With a growing population, having one police officer for every 500 citizens is not sustainable, especially during situations such as demonstrations. We must appreciate the work of the police. It is not right to label an entire institution as bad because of a few rotten apples. Just recently in Nakuru, there was a tragic femicide case where a young woman lost her life. She was beheaded and her family was in distress. The police arrested the perpetrator. Similarly, following an arson incident involving a boda boda rider in the Mukuru Affordable Housing area that led to the death of a young girl, the police quickly apprehended those responsible. The police are doing a good job in certain areas and we must acknowledge that. We must also recognise the issue of limited national resources, which prevents us from allocating funds to all the areas that require our attention. If we can allocate funds towards improving police stations, police accommodation, training and remuneration, we will do well as a country.

I wish to express my appreciation to the police for their services. We need to give them the very best to better serve wananchi. I want to tell the Police Force that we appreciate them and that we remember they are there to serve us and to provide security. We want them to continue doing so.

The Independent Policing Oversight Authority (IPOA) must effectively carry out its mandate. I am currently dealing with a case involving a young boy named Ryan, who was run over by a police officer within an estate. He was left paralysed from the waist down. His mother

was so busy caring for him and seeking the best treatment that she was time barred when it was time to go to court, but I got her a lawyer and the case has now been reinstated. The police have been enjoined and we hope Ryan will finally receive justice.

When the police do something wrong, we must ensure that there are clear budgetary provisions for reparations. Families require that money. When something is wrong, it is wrong. For instance, if two people who both have motor vehicle insurance are involved in a road accident and they know who is at fault, why not accept liability? I have had accidents on the road and if I know I am in the wrong, I accept liability and tell my insurer that I have covered the cost of the damages. Insurance companies tell us that we should not accept liability. The Government should operate similarly. In cases of wrongful death at the hands of the police, there is no need to make families go through a tiresome process just to get compensation. We should set aside a budget for such cases and promptly compensate them.

I know many people are against speed cameras and the courts have stopped their usage. However, speed cameras save the police a lot of unnecessary work. Speeding might occur at points on the road which are unmanned by the police, thus causing many accidents. The police are already strained with work and they may not be able to check on every speeding case. In the first week that the cameras were running, quite a number of drivers even here in Parliament received messages telling them that they had incurred fines of certain amounts. I told my driver that he would be on his own if he was caught speeding and, therefore, he should ensure that he does not break any laws. We need that discipline in the country. If we raise money from the indiscipline of Kenyans, they will eventually realise that indiscipline is costly. With time, there will be no speeding, we will reduce road carnage and allow the police to focus on other areas. We want a society where we are not just filling up our prisons, but are also creating opportunities and managing our society effectively.

I also propose that police stations hold open days to engage with the communities that they serve to bring about harmony and improve relationships between citizens and law enforcement officers. We should not look at a police officer and imagine that he or she just wants a bribe or he or she is inefficient. Police officers do not come from outer space. They are our Kenyan sons and daughters and they work hard. Even as we ridicule them, let us not stereotype them because not every officer out there has harmed you or will harm you. They exist to maintain law and order.

I support the amendment Bill. Their retirement age should be 60 years of age. They should also be given more resources, training and dignified living conditions. I thank the President for ensuring that we have institutional houses that allow the police to enjoy dignified living conditions.

Before Hon. Ochanda contributes, I want to recognise the presence of students in the Public Gallery.

Order, Hon. Waluke and company! You cannot turn this place into some kind of camel market. Should I say a camel market instead of a fish market?

I want to recognise the presence of students from the DEB Ontulili School from Buuri Constituency in Meru County, who are seated in the Public Gallery. I ask Hon. Rindikiri to recognise them. Is there any other Member from Meru County in the House? Hon. Rindikiri, please, share a word of encouragement with those future leaders of our country. Tell them that you are already getting tired, so that they can prepare to come and take over. It does not have to be in the next five years; it can be in the next 10 years. Proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. It is a privilege to welcome students from the DEB Ontulili School in Buuri West Sub-County, which is one of the sub-counties that forms part of Buuri Constituency, which I represent. This school is in a very dry area. We had to put up the school from scratch. Those are determined children who are ready to make it in life. I am happy that they have come to see the House where the laws of this country are made. Looking at the faces of those children, I see future leaders, engineers, doctors and good citizens of this country. I welcome them to the House. They can be future Members of Parliament.

Work very hard. Please, maintain discipline. Listen to your teachers. Obey your parents. Please, sit down, read and work hard. The future is in your hands. I thank the teachers and the school administration for bringing you here. It is not in vain. This is a historical visit for the school and it will bear something in future.

I thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

So that the girls in the Public Gallery from DEB Ontulili Primary School can also feel encouraged, I will ask Hon. Mnyazi Amina to encourage them in Kiswahili.

Ahsante sana, Mhe. Spika wa Muda. Nachukua fursa hii kuwakaribisha wanafunzi wetu katika Bunge. Hapa ndipo sheria za nchi nzima utungwa. Kama mnavyoona hapa, kuna viongozi tofauti tofauti. Naitwa Mhe. Mnyazi, Mbunge wa Malindi. Nyinyi bado ni watoto. Tunaomba muongeze bidii katika masomo yenu. Pia, muige mifano ya viongozi bora katika taifa letu la Kenya. Tunawaombea mema katika maisha yenu.

Ahsanteni sana na karibuni Bunge.

Thank you. Next is Hon. Ochanda, followed by Hon. Rachael Nyamai.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. At the outset, I support this Bill. It is a big anomaly in this country that we talk about the Inspector- General of Police, who is the Head of National Police Service (NPS) , without talking about the issue of age limit. This Bill tries to bring it around, which is perfect. We must have an age limit for purposes of professional and career progression.

What is happening, Hon. Temporary Speaker? I have seen some light.

That has nothing to do with you. Proceed.

Okay, thank you. We must have an age limit for purposes of professional and career progression. There are those who are below the Inspector-General of Police. They look forward to get to higher positions when they still have some time in service. When there is no age limit, we allow an officer to serve for more than the age limit that is required generally in the whole country for all the other services. That is very unfair, but it is good that this Bill is trying to cure it.

Below the Inspector-General of Police, we have the position of Deputy Inspector- General. The Bill proposes that the Inspector-General of Police should serve for four years and the Deputy Inspector-General will serve for five years. This is perfect for transitional purposes such that we do not just get a deputy becoming an Inspector-General of Police at a time when transitional arrangements are not in place properly.

Allow me to digress a little bit as we look at this because the Police Service has a lot of challenges. The biggest challenge now is vehicles. There is a police station in my constituency that has not had a vehicle for the last five years. There is another one that has not had a vehicle for the last number of months and yet, it is a border station. You can imagine what the police officers in those stations go through. They carry suspects on motorcycles. They do a lot of investigation while on motorcycles. There is no arrangement in place for them to be doing this.

You find that an officer commanding station (OCS) does not have the money, capital or a facility alternative to the car. The issue of vehicles needs to be re-looked at afresh because it is not only a problem in my constituency. I am aware there are many other constituencies that have police stations that do not have vehicles. It is very difficult for police officers to work without a police car.

As we look through the issues of retirement, NPS needs to be looked into thoroughly so that they are facilitated to work well. It is not very easy for police officers to travel on foot in the villages, looking around for suspects. Their security becomes a challenge.

I support the Bill. I wish it will be enacted quickly. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to contribute to this very important Bill. I support it. I congratulate Hon. Oku Kaunya. For those who do not know the Mover of the Bill, he has a lot of experience in the Police Service. He was a Regional Commissioner of Police. He was in charge of the Administration Police Training College. He served in the Police Service. He has a lot of understanding about the challenges that exist within the Police Service. I congratulate him for that.

I also congratulate him for being very useful when he was a member of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security. He did a lot of work. He supported the Chairman during the 12th Parliament. I congratulate him. This Bill will bring sanity in retirement age. I take a lot of time to follow wars in the world. The army or police officers who win are the ones who have the best education, experience, tools— including Information Technology tools—and Artificial Intelligence. We would like to see the best people in the Police Service, and at the top-most position of the Inspector-General of Police.

This Bill brings sanity in retirement age. When someone reaches the age of 60 years, they need to retire and give way to others. The qualifications are very wide because they have not restricted to only those who have done security courses. They have not only included criminal justice, but they have also added policy development and implementation, finance and public administration, strategic management, security, law, sociology and governance. Someone will not be told you will not be an inspector-general of police because you have not done security courses. This Bill is quite progressive.

The Bill ensures that the deputy inspector-general of police position is clear. It has not only put the age limit, but it has also added that whatever befalls the Inspector-General of Police also befalls the Deputy Inspector-General of Police. They have put an age limit of 60 years and included qualifications that ensure we do not pick a person who is not qualified and whom we are not proud of when he speaks. We are always happy when we see our Inspector- General of Police and Deputy Inspector-General of Police speaking in confidence. They speak in good English, Kiswahili and native languages, when they are called upon to do so. This gives us an opportunity to ensure that we have highly qualified people who have served this country.

I like the fact that this Bill protects people who work in the Police Service. Someone needs to not only have the qualifications, but must have also served in the Police Service for more than 15 years. This encourages our young security officers. It does not even give the lower limit. That means that a young person who has done extremely well and has the right qualifications can also be a deputy inspector-general or inspector-general in this country.

We have very good police officers in our constituencies. I know that we have some bad elements in the Police Force. A majority of them serve in very difficult areas like Mutha, Ikutha and Kanziku, where they find themselves dealing with matters that are not in their line of duty like social challenges in the society. As I stand here, I take this opportunity to thank them for offering themselves to work in rural areas, say in places like Mandera, just to ensure that we are secure in our country.

I also take this opportunity to thank the President for being bold to insist that we must have the housing project. It will not only benefit our schools and our institutions, but also our police officers. The President said that the housing project must comprise institutional housing for our police officers. It is so that they can stop living in uni-huts and enjoy dignified lives. I know the experience you have in this House and outside this House. You did a lot before you came to this House. You must have seen the uni-huts police officers used to live in. Therefore, with the institutional housing project, we have hope that our police officers will live well. I congratulate Hon. Oku Kaunya for the work he did before he joined this House and the work that he did in the 11th Parliament.

Hon. Nyamai, this is just to underscore what you have said. I went to the Administration Police Lines in Garissa not too long ago, and I saw the room which my father lived in as a Corporal. As a family of four, we lived in that one small room that was left behind by the colonial government. It is a shame for our officers to still be housed in those seriously dilapidated houses right now. Red bricks were used to construct them those old days. So, something has to be done. We are talking of 1964, that is 62 years since Independence and yet we have not improved the living quarters of our servicemen and servicewomen who stay awake day and night to protect us. We complain about them being corrupt without providing them with basic tools, a good environment to live in, good salary, serious medical cover, and compensation when they die in the line of duty. A lot needs to be done for our security officers before we start blaming them.

Continue, Hon. Nyamai. I felt I had to talk like that because my dad, who is now 94 years old, was a corporal in 1964.

Thank you.

Thank you very much, Hon. Speaker, for filling me in. Clearly, you have much more experience than I do. Concerning the matter of housing, and that is where I was, I would like to thank the Government. We have hope that our police officers will not continue to share the uni-huts. More than one family shares a uni-hut. We look forward to a time when the police officers will be happy with their remuneration and their service. At least, we have seen that there is some form of insurance, especially when police officers get hurt in the course of duty or unfortunately lose their lives in the line of duty. We have some form of insurance for them. I believe that is the way a country should take care of its police officers. I am not saying that they have everything they need. There is a lot more that needs to be done.

As I support the Bill by Hon. Oku Kaunya, it is also a good opportunity to say that a lot of work has been done in the Police Service. However, we would like to see more.

Hon. Amina Mnyazi. Unaweza kuongea kwa kutumia lugha ya Taifa. Ni jambo la fahari.

Ahsante sana, Mhe. Spika wa Muda. Ni jambo la furaha sana. Leo nina furaha ya kutoa mchango wangu kuhusu Huduma ya Kitaifa ya Polisi. Naunga mkono Mswada ulio mbele yetu. Utaleta uwazi wa kazi, uzoefu na sifa ya Inspekta Jenerali Mkuu ambaye kwa kiingereza ndiye Inspector-General of Police (IG) pamoja na naibu Inspekta Jenerali Mkuu ambaye ndiye Deputy Inspector-General of Police (DIG) . Vitu kama hivi ndivyo tunavyo vihitaji ili tuweze kuendeleza Kenya yetu. Kama vile Wabunge wenzangu walivyoeleza, huu mwenendo ambao twataka kuweka sasa hivi utatusaidia sisi kama unavyosaidia jeshi letu ambako mambo hufanyika bila siasa kuingizwa kati. Tunataka huduma za polisi zitolewe bila hujuma na mapendeleo yoyote ya wanasiasa.

Mswada huu unazungumzia, hususan, kuhusu hao maafisa wawili na ninauunga mkono. Katika hizi kazi mbili muhimu za Inspekta Jenerali Mkuu na naibu wake, tunahitaji watu walio na uzoefu wa kazi, waliopanda ngazi katika kazi ya polisi kuanzia chini mpaka juu, na wanaoelewa kinagaubaga kazi za ofisi mbalimbali za polisi pamoja na challenges zilizoko.

Ikumbukwe kuwa, Inspekta Jenerali Mkuu pamoja na naibu wake ni watu ambao tutaangalia uzoefu wao wa kazi. Hatutaangalia misuli ya miili yao au kama wanaweza kukimbia. Sisi tunataka watu ambao wana experience na hekima, na watakaoweza kuendesha vizuri Huduma ya Kitaifa ya Polisi ili tuendelee kuwa na amani hapa Kenya.

[The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Farah Maalim] left the Chair] [The Temporary Speaker (Hon. (Dr) Rachel Nyamai] in the Chair] Tunapojadili huu Mswada wa Huduma ya Kitaifa ya Polisi, ni muhimu pia tuwaangalie polisi wa ngazi za chini. Sasa hivi, tunajadili kuhusu Inspekta Jenerali Mkuu pamoja na naibu wake na tayari najua sheria ziko… Shida yetu ni kuwa kuna sheria kadha wa kadha ambazo hazifuatwi vizuri na ndiyo maana makosa madogo madogo hutokea hapa na pale. Jambo la kwanza ambalo ningependa lipigwe msasa katika kikosi cha polisi ni kitu kinachoitwa uhamisho ama transfer. Ni vibaya sana polisi kuketi kwa kituo kimoja zaidi ya miaka kumi au kumi na mitano. Mwisho wa siku, polisi hao huungana na wahalifu wa hayo maeneo. Kama kuna msako, watawapa information kisha kushika hao wahalifu inakuwa tatizo. Ikiwa ni shida ya uozo wa vijana wa vipanga, licha ya kuwajua, kuwashika inakuwa tatizo. Kwa hivyo, sheria za uhamisho zinafaa zitiliwe mkazo zaidi. Kama polisi ameripoti kwa kituo cha polisi mahali fulani, ijulikane atakua hapo kwa muda gani ili muda huo unapotimia, aondoke aende kuhudumu katika kituo kingine katika taifa letu la Kenya.

Jambo la pili ambalo ningependa lipigwe msasa ni kuhusu promotion kazini. Tunajua tuko na vikosi tofauti vya polisi. Lakini, si haki kwa polisi kuhudumu katika nafasi moja ya kazi kwa muda wa miaka kumi. So, jambo hili ni lazima lipigwe msasa. Hii leo kama polisi ameandikwa kama constable, baada ya muda Fulani, lazima apandishwe cheo ili apige hatua kazini.

Suala la mafunzo pia ni jambo muhimu kwa kikosi chetu cha polisi. Najua linaendelea lakini napendekeza, baada ya muda, Serikali iongeze msukumo wake zaidi ili wengi waweze kupata mafunzo.

Mwisho ni kitu ambacho kinaitwa counselling kwa polisi wetu. Napendekeza tuwe na counselling nzuri na madhubuti katika police stations zetu ili polisi wetu waweze kusaidiwa na mambo yanayowasumbua akilini na kuwatatiza katika maisha yao. Napendekeza hivyo kwa sababu kuna polisi wanaopitia shida nyingi na wengine ni walevi wa kila siku. Nina imani kuwa polisi wakikaa na kuongeleshwa juu ya changamoto kama hizo, dhiki walizo nazo rohoni na akilini zitatatulilwa. Naunga mkono huu Mswada.

Ahsante.

Hon. Caroli Omondi.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to lend support to this Bill. I do not think we could have found a more experienced Member than Hon. Oku Kaunya to introduce this particular Bill and work through it with the stakeholders. Hon. Kaunya is a man with extensive experience in the disciplined service. I am very glad to support his Bill.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, the main thrust of this Bill is that the retirement age of the Inspector-General of Police will be 60 years. I have read the Report and did a little research on it. In the Republic of South Africa, Republic of India, and the Federal Republic of Nigeria, the head of the police service retires at the age of 60. As someone who attended junior paramilitary training at the National Youth Service (NYS) , I think at the age of 60, it may become

increasingly difficult for members of the service to do something called 5BX, which are mandatory physical exercises every morning.

If you allow me, I can intermingle the language a bit for purposes of demonstration as the standing orders allow. In the disciplined service, they will tell you: “Kidevu juu, kifua mbele, matako nyuma, miguu square.” That may become increasingly difficult….

What is out of order, Hon. Barasa.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I wanted to inform Hon. Caroli Omondi that the Inspector-General…

I need to ask Hon. Caroli Omondi whether he would like to be informed.

No.

In that case, Hon. Barasa, you will get a chance.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, lately, I have been under a lot of attacks, which is why I did not allow my friend to inform me. I do not know where he is coming from.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, as I said earlier, in the disciplined forces, physical fitness is one very important attribute, and so is hierarchy. I believe that the age of 60 is adequate for retirement purposes. However, I must insist on assurances that this will not apply retroactively. That is because at present, we have a very capable and able Inspector-General of Police, one Mr. Douglas Kanja. I hope that this will not apply retroactively to affect the term of the current Inspector-General. As a House, we need to make it very clear that there will be no retroactive application of the retirement age and that we should respect Mr. Kanja’s contract of four years, until he retires naturally, as was in the old order.

Secondly, I would like to propose that the Inspector-General of Police be a person who has risen through the ranks of the Police Service. Looking at the proposals on the qualifications, we are opening it to anybody with 15 years of experience in different fields. Yet, when you look at the qualifications of the Deputy Inspector-General of Police, we are limiting it to those who have experience within the service. For purposes of good order, we need to protect the service against people who may, for political reasons, find their way there and demotivate members of the service. We need to amend on the Floor that whoever is appointed Inspector-General of Police should have experience in the security sector, whether in the police service, military or somewhere else, so that the hierarchy of the disciplined service is maintained.

There was another proposal that the Bill be redone further to offer protection to those in office from arbitrary political removal. We need to look for a way to insulate police officers from arbitrary political action that may intimidate and discourage them from upholding the rule of law.

There is also a proposal under Clause 11 that the Deputy Inspector-General of Police be appointed by the President on the recommendation of the Commission. I agree with that. However, I think we should take it further and insist that the recommendation be based on

competitive selection as per the requirements of the Constitution. So, if a person is being recommended for the position of Inspector-General of Police by the Commission, they must have held some interviews and opened up that particular position to competition.

With those remarks, I support. I will be moving certain amendments when the time comes. Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Hon. John Waluke.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me a chance to contribute to this Bill.

Member for Sirisia, please, take your seat. Hon. Members, please allow me to give this opportunity to Hon. Jackson Kosgei, our nominated Member. I will come back to you, Member for Sirisia.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. As I take the Floor, I support the National Police Service (Amendment) Bill, (National Assembly Bill No. 39 of 2025) by Hon. Kaunya.

As my colleagues have mentioned about the appointment of the Inspector-General of Police, the priority should be given to the members of the Police Service for reasons that have been outlined before. In this Bill, it should be very clear that we are giving priority to members who are serving in the service, so that the 15 years mentioned gives priority to them. Additionally, this amendment will clarify the relationship between the Inspector-General of Police and the National Police Service Commission to avoid conflicts between the two that have led them to go to court recently.

As we look at this Bill, I wish to appeal to Kenyans to be patriotic enough, and respect the officers because police officers are serving the interests of every citizen on behalf of all of us. When we see them by the roadside, when we meet and interact with them, it is not an issue of us versus them. They are serving the citizens of this country.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, in our budgeting process, we should give the Police Service priority. It is disheartening to hear about police officers asking private facilitators to give them vehicles or fuel and yet, they are serving the interests of the country. It has been said that the role of the police service in any country is to enforce the law. They are the ones who are mandated to enforce the law within the borders of a nation with the interest of every citizen in mind. There work is to deter crime, provide emergency response to the people, and provide support services for other institutions that serve the citizens of Kenya. Why should they not be a priority in our Budget? I am appealing to this House to strengthen the Budget by apportioning enough resources for the Police Service.

Finally, we need to consider the welfare of the men and women in uniform. We have some officers who have been injured in the course of duty. When the regulations are done, it should be well stated that the welfare of the men and women who get injured in the course of duty, or beyond, is well taken care of.

With that, Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support.

Member for Sirisia.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I thank Hon. Oku Kaunya for bringing this Bill. It was long overdue because there are so many challenges in the Police Force. I know Hon. Kaunya has been in the Force and he worked well. He knew when he was preparing this Bill to bring it to the Floor of the House. So, at the outset, I support this, Bill.

There are a lot of challenges that are facing our Police Force. Some of them are about the welfare of the police, or let me say the uniformed people, right from the military, police, Administration Police (AP) , to prisons. All of them have many challenges that the Government needs to give priority. This is because their work is important to this nation. Without security, the country cannot be governed.

There is the challenge of vehicles. Many police stations do not have vehicles. Most of the time, the officers use boda boda motorbikes, which is also very dangerous to their lives. They are even exposed to their enemies. Sometimes, when they arrest people, they are targeted. The Government needs to take this matter seriously and ensure that vehicles are available. Like in my constituency, the police in my sub-county do not have even one vehicle. I used to have four of them, but they were taken to areas that had problems like Lamu and Mount Elgon. Those vehicles have not been brought back. So, my police officers are having so many problems in terms of police operations and yet, we are on the border. Sometimes our neighbours come and steal animals from our sub-county and police officers cannot even move. So, mobility for the police officers all over the country should be checked.

On retirement, we are talking about the transition of an officer who has been serving for five years, that is, the Inspector-General (IG). To me, those persons, after serving and reaching their age of retirement, they must leave. It is because we are trying to bring up young people who are also in that line. When the IG leaves, the positions that are going to be created are right from the IG trickling down to the rank of a corporal. So, in the middle, a chain of ranks will be created. The research showed that when you reach 60 years (initially it was 55 years), you are supposed to leave the service so that you can rest. They knew that after 55 years or 60 years, your brain is also tired and you cannot work very well.

Once we pass this Bill, persons who were appointed to positions two years or three years ago and they are now 61 years or 62 years old, they should leave office for other officers to take over.

With those few remarks, I support.

Hon. Irene Mayaka, nominated Member.

Asante sana Mhe. Spika wa Muda kwa kunipatia fursa hii ili nichangie mjadala huu wa marekebisho ya Mswada wa Huduma ya Polisi katika taifa la Kenya.

Kwanza kabisa namshukuru Mhe. Oku Kaunya kwa kuleta Mswada huu kwa sababu alifanya kazi katika huduma ya usalama katika nchi hii na amechangia sana katika nafasi hiyo. Tunamshukuru kwa sababu ameleta Mswada ambao utasaidia sana. Mswada huu, kwanza kabisa, unalenga kuhakikisha kuwa kazi ya mkuu wa polisi inakuwa na kikomo cha miaka. Wanaofanya kazi katika Utumishi wa Umma pia wanafaa kustaafu wakifikisha miaka 60. Mswada huu unahakikisha kwamba sera hiyo ya umri wa miaka 60 pia inatekelezwa katika idara ya polisi ili watu wote wanaofanya kazi katika Huduma ya Polisi na Utumishi wa Umma wawe na nafasi ya kustaafu wanapofikisha umri wa miaka 60.

La pili, baadhi ya marekebisho ambayo Mhe. Oku Kaunya anapendekeza ni kuhakikisha kuwa naibu mkuu wa polisi pia anafanya kazi kwa kipindi cha miaka mitano mara moja pekee. Hii inasaidia sana kwa sababu mwenye atahudumu kama mkuu wa polisi au naibu wake atapewa muhula mmoja wa kuhudumu aonyeshe umaarufu wake ili wengine wapate hiyo nafasi.

Ingawa tunataka kutekeleza marekebisho haya ambayo tunayaunga mkono, polisi nchini Kenya wanafanya kazi ya maana sana. Tunataka kuhakikisha kuwa wale ambao wako katika nafasi ya uongozi katika Huduma ya Polisi wanahakikishiwa kwamba wako na kazi rahisi ya kufanya kwa kupatiwa nyumba bora na sera mwafaka ili wanapofanya kazi ya kutumikia wananchi wa Kenya, wawe na akili timamu kupitia ushauri.

Mhe. Spika wa Muda, namshukuru Mhe. Oku Kaunya kwa kuleta Mswada huu wa Marekebisho ili sisi kama Bunge la Kitaifa tuujadili tuwasaidie Wakenya wote.

Kwa hayo machache, naunga mkono.

Hon. Didmus Baraza, also known as Titimus.

I am also known as Mutua. Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I want to be clear that I support this Bill with serious amendments. Members have alluded to the fact that when one is 60 years old, one is brain-tired. I do not agree with that assumption because in this country, a judge of the High Court retires at the age of 70. The Chief Justice also retires at the age of 70.

I want to bring to the attention of the House the fact that the duties of the holder of the position of Inspector-General are completely different from those of a police corporal or police constable. This is a crime buster. He does administrative duties. Even if he is at the age of 70 or 65 years, it does not matter because he is not required to participate in the exercises that Hon. Caroli Omondi was talking about. Even if he has a belly bigger than that of our former Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration, it does not matter. His duty is to issue command. He can issue command while drinking tea or smoking cigarettes, if he smokes. He is exempted from rigorous exercises. This is an individual who must have experience in studying crime patterns in our country. He must also have experience in reviewing the police standing orders in order to ensure that we live in a country that has minimal crime.

I will, therefore, be moving an amendment to increase the retirement age of an inspector-general of police and his deputies, including the retirement age of the Director of Criminal Investigations (DCI) . Those are people who should retire at the age of 60 years. If we trust the functionality of the brains of judges of the High Court and that of the Chief Justice beyond the 60 year-age limit, even the Inspector-General of Police and his deputies can benefit this country at the age of 60 years or 65 years. In fact, the older the inspector-general, the more intelligent they are in terms of using the experience they have acquired in fighting crime in this country. It even makes them more suitable to serve in the position of inspector- general.

I will be proposing to delete some provisions in this Bill. We need to make it clear that for one to be an Inspector-General or Deputy Inspector-General, they must be from within the Service. When one is from within the Service, the issues of Chapter 6 of the Constitution should not come into play. This is because one is already in the Service. If anybody contravenes Chapter 6 of the Constitution, whether one is an Officer Commanding Police Division (OCPD) or a County Police Commander (CPC) , one should be removed from the Service. This will ensure that by the time the President nominates somebody for appointment as an Inspector- General or Deputy Inspector-General from within the Service, the nominees are already fit to serve in those positions. We also need not to repeat issues like whether someone has been convicted by a court of law, because Chapter 6 of the Constitution already covers all those aspects.

Nonetheless, I thank the sponsor of this Bill, Hon. Oku Kaunya. He served in the defunct Public Administration of this country. He, therefore, understands what requires to be done to improve the National Police Service.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, even as we seek to improve this Bill, we must try to make the Offices of the Inspector-General and the Deputy Inspector-General immune to political interference. We must also try to improve the conditions of the Police Service in terms of the manner in which police officers carry out their operations. I will be proposing more amendments to improve the Bill further in terms of ensuring that we consider the track record of the persons who will be getting into those positions. Even if a candidate was an Officer Commanding Station (OCS) , we should look at how he/she executed the functions of that role. This will ensure that we get an Inspector-General who will use his/her experience to ensure that we operate in a crime-free country.

I reiterate that in support of this Bill, I will bring amendments to improve it further, so that we exclude the Inspector-General of Police, Deputy Inspector-Generals and other senior commanding officers from retiring at the age of 60 years. They should borrow from what

happens in the military. In the military, a corporal, who is required to be physically fit, retires at the age of 45. If he will not have risen to the rank of sergeant before attaining the age of 45, he automatically retires from the military service. Your services will no longer be required. Sergeants and warrant officers handle some administrative duties. They retire at the ages of 52 and 55 respectively. Senior military officers, who are war planners, retire at the age of 65 and 70 years.

We should, therefore, not exclude the National Police Service from those provisions because the Constitution and the law seek equity for all Kenyans. We cannot be saying that a judge of the High Court is mentally stable at the age of 69 but a police officer is mentally unstable at the age of 60. Those are double standards. We want a country of equity and fairness, where people are given equal opportunities. The President of the Republic of Kenya has no age limit. As long as you are elected, even if you are 100 years old, you run the country. We must harmonize these matters because Kenya is not The Animal Farm, where some animals are more equal than others. Kenya is a land of equal opportunities regardless of age. We should work around that level.

With those many remarks, I support with an intent to introduce amendments to this Bill.

Thank you. Next is Hon. Charles Ngusya, Member for Mwingi West.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker for giving me this opportunity. I begin by appreciating the good work that my friend, Hon. Kaunya, has been doing since he came to Parliament. We have been attending gym with this Member. I request the people of his constituency to re-elect him for the good work that he has been doing in Parliament in the years they have sent him here.

I begin by supporting this Bill simply because of two issues. First, it seeks to provide an age limit for the Inspector-General and his deputies. Secondly, it addresses the issues of capacity and ability to handle the demanding nature of the job in terms of what the Inspector-General and his deputies go through on a daily basis. If you visit those offices, you will appreciate that those people go through strenuous activities on a daily basis. They serve this country round the clock. The Inspector-General and his deputies are ever busy addressing issues of insecurity and maintenance of law and order across the country. The functions of those offices require serious personalities with capacity and good health. This Bill is very important. We must support it to ensure that when people attain the age of 60, they are relieved of the duties of those offices, which are physically and mentally demanding. We can then get young and dynamic persons to continue the legacies of their retired bosses.

I sit in the Constitutional Implementation Oversight Committee (CIOC) . There are conflicting roles of the Inspector-General and Deputy Inspector-Generals on one hand and the roles of the National Police Service Commission (NPSC) on the other hand, which we need to separate. For example, there have been conflicting issues regarding transfers, promotions, training and, more importantly, recruitment and retention of police officers. We need to make the mandates of each of those offices, which are already enshrined in our Constitution, clear. We also need to address the prevailing challenges within the National Police Service, of course, including the endemic corruption. This is because police officers are not adequately compensated.

I would like to appreciate the Government for what it has done so far in improving the salaries of police officers. We also need to ensure that we address the challenge of inadequate housing. Right now, we have a housing levy, which is a game changer in this country. It is building many structures across the nation. We would like to collaborate with the police officers to ensure that the conditions at all police stations are improved. We must ensure that there is adequate housing for our officers so that they live in dignity. There are many issues we

can address but, in order not to digress from this Bill, I would like to support. We should ensure that it is properly implemented once it is approved.

With those few remarks, I fully support the Bill and congratulate Hon. Kaunya. Keep doing the good job for the people of Teso. Ahsante sana.

Thank you. Hon. Florence Jematiah, I am sorry I have not been able to locate your name on the system. I know that you have been seated here since morning.

Please, proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I also want to join my colleagues in congratulating the Mover and supporting this Bill. I want to add to what Members have said.

Hon. Kaunya is a citizen who has served in the security spectrum of Kenya. Security is paramount in every sphere of society. The amendments contained in this Bill regards the National Police Service Act, where we consider the employment or appointment of an Inspector General. This is a very important provision of the Constitution. A police officer is a member of the society who endures much, specifically in terms of security. When we go to sleep in our safe places at night, we enjoy our pretty sleep because a policeman is in charge.

In this Bill, we are considering the positions of the Inspector-General of Police and Deputy Inspector-Generals. This is a person who should be of sound mind. I like the proposition contained in the Bill. The candidate should be well versed in terms of the Constitution. The candidate should be literate, and should understand the dynamics of the society.

We live in a society where things change every day and every minute because of globalization of the world through social media and technology. This is a very good component because when you have a Deputy Inspector General who is able to understand criminal matters, management policies, strategic management and law, the National Police Service will be governed properly. I also note that as much as Hon. Kaunya is a Member of Parliament, he is suggesting that one cannot be qualified to be a Deputy Inspector General if one once served as a Member of Parliament or is currently serving as a Member of Parliament. He has his reasons for that proposition, but being a Member of Parliament is akin to being a police officer. That is because we do what every other person does.

Looking at it clearly, I would not mind if I were once a Member of Parliament and I became Deputy Inspector General of Police today. This is because I am able to understand the people I serve, having served them properly before. They gave me the opportunity to serve them because they knew that I was able to do the work. One thing about politics is that the idiosyncrasy and personality of the leader is what matters. As you know, we cannot legislate morals. Still, many times we short-change ourselves when we hold ourselves in such high regard but still think that we are unable to perform certain roles because of our previous jobs. I will probably ask the Member to consider a debate on that point.

Age is also a factor. At 60 years, it is quite reasonable for one to be employed. Sometimes, people who are 60 years old and above are also capable. Those are people who have institutional memory of society. They are people we depend on every day. That is why we have elders in the Nyumba Kumi initiative. We can also have an office that is able to accommodate such people who have served in the civil service for up to 60 years as they are able to give service to society again because we still need them. Their basic understanding is often better than someone who has just walked into the position.

With those remarks, I support the Bill in totality.

Thank you. Hon. Joshua Kimilu, Member for Kaiti.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I want to congratulate the Hon. Member for coming up with such a Bill. It is a very good and important Bill. I sponsored a Bill in this House, and it was passed. Therefore, I have experience when it comes to Bills. Later on, I will talk to the Hon. Member so that we can discuss the possibility of introducing an amendment. I will propose an amendment because there is something I want to correct. Otherwise, it is a good Bill and, with a small amendment during the Committee of the whole House, I know we will make it one of the best Bills that has ever been enacted by this House.

When it comes to the appointment of the Inspector-General of Police, it is important for us to be very sensitive to those people because I know what the police are going through in this country. The environment they work in is sometimes pathetic. Sometimes, they go through hell in the course of performing their duties. While we sleep, others stay awake protecting Kenyans.

Therefore, as we handle matters of policing, we must be very sensitive and careful because police officers are our sons and our daughters. We need to treat them well. In my constituency, I have four police stations. I occasionally visit them to see how they are faring on. I have noted that they are facing serious challenges. Their vehicles are old, and they break down frequently. The environment where their offices are situated is wanting. Sometimes, I have had to intervene through the National Government Constituencies Development Fund (NG-CDF) to make their offices look better. For the Inspector-General to be appointed, one must have gone through all those processes. Chapter Six of the Constitution provides for integrity and the process for appointment of the Inspector-General. Therefore, I have no problem with some of the amendments that have been proposed in this Bill.

We also need to consider the fact that when someone reaches the age of 60, it does not mean that, that person is dying. What is important is to ensure that the Government of Kenya is ready to pay the pensions of those people. We also need to consider the young generation coming up in the Police Service. We have young people who want to become Inspector- Generals or Deputy Inspectors-General. We must be careful regarding the age limit and see how we can make that position available to all qualified persons in the service. We know that the duties that our police perform are not easy. Two weeks ago, I was watching a television clip on what the police training involves and what they face in the line of duty. I saw a clip of the Kapedo incident and felt like crying, seeing what our police go through to secure the people of this country.

In this regard, I want to assure our police officers that we are here to fight for them to ensure that they get a good working environment. As Members of Parliament, we also need to see how our police officers can get better pay. They are currently earning peanuts. The leadership of this country needs to be sensitive to the welfare of our police officers.

I urge our police officers to be careful when they handle us during political rallies. It is unfortunate that they respond by throwing teargas at us when we go out to raise our voices so that they may get a better pay. As a member of the Linda Mwananchi initiative, I warn the police of this country not to take that direction. They come to throw tear gas at us as we fight for them. That is nonsense. I urge the police to be sensitive, careful and supportive of some of our meetings since we are here to fight for them. For them, raising their voices risks being sacked.

You know the kind of government we currently have. We are here to fight for them. I also request the police to maintain discipline and conduct themselves properly during political rallies.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

What is out of order, Hon. Ngusya Nguna? Before you proceed, I have heard the word “nonsense”. That word is completely un-parliamentary language. We must respect the rules of this House. I have a point of order from the Member for Mwingi West, who is already on his feet. What is out of order?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, is it in order for the Member to use un-parliamentary language? I have heard him use words like ‘nonsense’. Kindly ask him to withdraw.

Secondly, how can he say that the police do not conduct themselves properly and yet, they are the ones who maintain law and order? I want the Member to expound more on what he said. He is misleading the House.

Member for Kaiti, we will prosecute one at a time.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Hon. Nguna is a friend of mine. He joined the Government the other day. Already, his mouth and stomach are full. He has also increased his weight since then. Allow me not to respond to Hon. Nguna.

I think you are completely out of order, Member for Kaiti. Member for Mwingi West.

You know very well that Parliament, the Judiciary and the Executive are arms of the Government. Is the Member in order to claim that I joined the Government when he is also in Government? I have been in Government. Besides the Executive and the Judiciary, Parliament is part of the Government. The Member needs to read and understand the Constitution before uttering some words. He is misleading the House totally.

First, you have only one minute remaining. I would like you to be careful with your language. I know you seem to be emotional because of politics. This is a very important Bill and you had debated it well. Kindly, conclude without using hurtful words towards the Member for Mwingi West. That is extremely wrong. I would like you to apologise for the un-parliamentary language that you have used. Member for Kaiti, is it two or three terms?

It is a three-term. Thank you for giving me three terms. That is good. I want to use the right language. I do not mean the Government. I meant the broad-based government. I want to conclude.

To be precise, Member for Kaiti, you are out of order based on our Standing Orders.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

What else is out of order, Hon. Member for Buuri?

We have children from schools who are present. You are portraying a bad example in this House. You have used a totally un-parliamentary language. The children who are here did not come to hear statements or words that are not compatible with this House. Hon. Kimilu needs to apologise unconditionally.

Member for Nyeri County.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I request the Hon. Member to apologise. I think it is Hon. Nguna’s democratic right to be wherever he

wants to be. Again, as Hon. Rindikiri has said, we have children here. We are leaders. I do not think it is right to use vulgar language. Let the Hon. Member apologise before he continues.

Member for Kaiti, based on our Standing Order 107A (2) , “un-parliamentary language” means the use of words which, in the opinion of the person presiding, are deemed to be impolite, rude, abusive and inconsistent with the parliamentary procedure or practice. Based on this, I ask you to withdraw and apologise to the House.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Before I withdraw, I want…

I would like you to start with the withdrawal and apology.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I do not think it is a matter of apologising but rather a matter of withdrawal. I want to withdraw the word ‘nonsense’.

Member for Kaiti, withdraw and apologise to the House. I do not worry so much about the children who are here but we have rules in this House and you have gone against our Standing Orders. I order that you withdraw and apologise.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I want to withdraw and even before I apologise, because I have to apologise, I would like to say that Hon. Rindikiri is my Chairman in the Departmental Committee on Housing, Urban Planning and Public Works. I know why he is against me. He cannot just say that it is un-parliamentary language. For the sake of this House, I withdraw and apologise.

Your time is up. Hon. Members, before we proceed, I would like to recognise our guests. Seated in the Speaker’s Gallery this afternoon, we have students from St. Bonaventure Kaheti Boys’ High School from Mukurweini in Nyeri County. We also have students from Gichocho Junior School from Kiambu Constituency in Kiambu County. I would like to welcome all of them to the House to continue observing our proceedings.

I would like to give a chance to the Member for Nyeri County to welcome the students.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I would like to welcome the boys from St. Bonaventure Kaheti Boys’ High School from Mukurweini. Karibuni sana. This is where we work. I am sure you are learning a lot from this House. I want to apologise on behalf of the Member who has spoken inappropriately and say that we are always good and we are here to represent you. When you go back to Nyeri, greet your parents. Have a safe journey back home. I wish you well. Thank you.

Thank you very much Member for Nyeri County. Let us have Hon. Ibrahim Saney, the Member for Wajir North.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I have some issues with this Bill that is seeking to amend the National Police Service Act. I do not have to belabour the point. The requisite qualifications for one to be appointed Inspector- General (IG) and Deputy Inspector-General are obvious, and not in the context of their removal or non-qualification. I am straightforward. I do not have to talk much about that now.

However, of importance to me is that the National Police Service play a very important role in this country to the extent that should we have five minutes without policing, we would lose our nation. That is the extent to which they are important. They are a very important sector of our security and their work is majorly to enforce the law. That function requires non-interference and non-politicisation of such a vital sector of the Government. We do not have to legislate for the person holding the office in mind but for the office itself for purposes of perpetuity. We are making laws for generations to come, and not for the current

Inspector-General and his deputies. We are doing this even for subsequent inspector-generals. Therefore, we must be objective and clear. Hypothetically, if you legislate having in mind a particular inspector-general, say the current one, the same ill-framed law can catch up with a future inspector-general whom you like and who is effective and performing. Let us legislate objectively for perpetuity.

I heard a colleague trying to blame the Inspector-General for many things about the National Police Service. At Independence, we used to have a Police Force but we have had a Police Service since the promulgation of the Constitution of Kenya, 2010.

Order, Hon. Saney. You will have a balance of eight minutes when debate on this Bill resumes. Ensure that you are in the House so that you can utilise your eight minutes.

Hon. Members, the time being

Published by Clerk of the National Assembly