Wednesday, 22nd April 2026

Members, there is no quorum. Serjeant-at-Arms, ring the Quorum Bell.

Serjeant-at-Arms, you may now stop the Quorum Bell. We are ready to proceed. First Order.

Members, I wish to convey that the Office of the Speaker of the National Assembly is in receipt of a formal complaint from the outgoing Chairperson of the National Cohesion and Integration Commission (NCIC) raising serious allegations on the conduct of the Chairperson of the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education, Hon. Jack Wanami Wamboka.

In the letter, Rev. (Dr) Samuel Kobia, CBS, states that in addition to the alleged open hostility, harassment and demeaning treatment of officers of NCIC by the Chairperson, the NCIC has credible concerns regarding allegations that the Chairperson has demanded inducements as a pre-condition to grant audience or favourable consideration during Committee proceedings. He concludes by seeking the intervention of the Hon. Speaker to cause an impartial investigation into the allegations which, if proven, constitute abuse of office and a violation of Chapter 6 of the Constitution and the statutory provisions on Leadership and Integrity.

Consequent to Rev. Kobia’s letter, the Member for Homabay Town, Hon. Peter Kaluma, CBS, has also formally written to the Hon. Speaker on the matter. In his letter, Hon. Kaluma claims to have found possession of the letter from NCIC and urges that if the complaint is not urgently investigated and addressed, it may “disable the Parliament of Kenya in the discharge of its oversight mandate”.

Drawing from the precedence of previous Speakers, and as the Speaker has rightly held during this 13th Parliament, any allegation of corrupt practice, bribery or attempted bribery, is a stain on the privilege of the institution of Parliament which calls for expeditious investigation and action.

As a House, we have recently participated in the passage of the Conflict of Interest Bill, 2025 and are all aware of both its ramifications and the implications on the broader ethical framework contained in Chapter 6 of the Constitution, the Anti-Corruption and Economic Crimes Act (Cap. 65) and the Leadership and Integrity Act (Cap. 185C), Members are also fully aware that upon taking oath of office, each of us subscribes to the Code of Conduct to Members of Parliament, contained in the Forth Schedule to the Parliamentary Powers and Privileges Act (Cap. 6).

Members, the established practice of the House requires that once an issue touching on privilege of the House is raised, as now has been done by Hon. Kaluma, the issue must be dispensed with as a matter of priority. The Standing Orders and the practices and precedence that we observe ordinarily, require the Speaker to guide the House on the next course of action on the matter of privilege without delay. However, the House is now faced with a rather novel issue. Whereas the records of the House indicate that the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education comprises of a total of 15 members who discharge the mandate of the Committee, the complaint at hand is couched in fairly specific terms against only the Chairperson of the Committee.

It would, therefore, greatly benefit the Speaker to receive any interventions or comment on the allegations from the House before proceeding to guide on the matter. I invite any intervention or comment, if any. In doing so, I will accord priority to any member of the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education present in the House this morning and further direct that the interventions and comments be strictly limited to the complaint as conveyed against the Chairperson of the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education, and any proposed remedy. Thank you, Members.

Members who wish to comment, please, press the intervention button. I will give priority to Members of the Committee. Members of the Committee, kindly press the intervention button if you would like to comment. Hon. Mwenje, are you a member of the Committee?

Yes, I am.

Do you wish to comment? I can see you have pressed the button.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. The Communication you have just made concerns the Chairman, Hon. Jack Wamboka. For the record, I sit in that Committee, and as is well known, I am also part of the leadership of the House. The allegations made against the Chair are quite alarming. I believe it would be unfair, guided by Article 47 on fair hearing, that we do not give the Chairman an opportunity to be heard on this issue, as it has come as a surprise to those of us who sit in the Committee. We would need to know whether there is proof to these allegations. If so, we should allow for some form of investigation to be conducted.

As a Committee, I want it on record that we have always acted in the best interest of the public, as required by the Constitution. Members seated here know that our Committee has had one of the highest attendance records. We have never lacked quorum. This Committee is charged with examining the books of accounts for universities, TVETs, and other institutions.

We were actually scheduled to sit this morning to consider several institutions. Therefore, I believe we may need to stand that down and allow the Powers and Privileges Committee, or any other appropriate mechanism as guided by yourself, to take up the matter. Notably, this Committee is one where even first-time Members are given leadership opportunities. For instance, Hon. Boyd Were was elected as Vice-Chair.

In fairness, Hon. Jack Wamboka should be given an opportunity to appear and respond to these serious allegations. However, I request that the entire 15-Member Committee should not be condemned, as only one member has been mentioned.

I have seen Hon. Maina Mathenge, Member for Nyeri. I will come to you.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I am the Vice-Chair of the National Cohesion and Equal Opportunities Committee. In our oversight of this Commission, at no time during our engagements was this matter brought to our attention.

Secondly, what is the procedure for any entity or Commission to be granted audience by a Committee of Parliament? We would like to be furnished with a paper trail indicating how many times this Commission has sought to appear before the relevant Public Investments Committee, or how many times it has been invited, and whether those invitations were honoured.

I raise these issues because they go to the question of integrity, not just of Hon. Wamboka or this Committee but of the entire House, including all Committee Chairs and Members. Therefore, as you give direction, we request that any decision be guided by concrete evidence, including how entities engage Committees under the Standing Orders.

Hon. Deputy Speaker Member for Igembe Central, Hon. Karitho. I see you are a Member of the Committee. Give him the microphone.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I am a member of the Committee. We have invited the Commission more than three times, and each time they have failed to appear.

At the same time, there are numerous irregularities involving public funds. I do not understand how the Commission can raise allegations against the Chair when they have declined to appear before the Committee to respond to issues concerning misuse of public funds. There are instances where funds were withdrawn without notice, without reports, and without authorisation. We sought explanations, but they failed to attend. The Commission should not come to Parliament to shield itself from accountability. If they have any evidence against the Chair, they must prove it beyond reasonable doubt, rather than make allegations to deflect from their own shortcomings.

As a Committee, we are known to be firm and thorough. We have handled many institutions, and none has ever accused us of intimidation or harassment. Our record is clean, including attendance and the quality of work done. We are currently reviewing the 2024/2025 audit cycle, and I believe we are among the best committees in this House.

Hon. Ambassador Sigei.

Thank you, Hon. Speaker. I am also a Member of Public Investments Committee. The issues raised are of a grave nature. I support the call by Hon. Karitho, for proper investigations so that the truth can be established. These are serious allegations which require substantive evidence to be tabled before this House. We are not protecting the Chair. What we are saying is that this matter should be done in the proper manner, which can make this House remain a House of integrity. I would like to see, as a member of that Committee, due process followed so that we can be vindicated as a Committee. I do not protect any corruption, but this matter must be handled in the proper manner.

Thank you.

Yes, proceed. Give him the microphone.

I will come to you, Hon. Osoro.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. This is a very heavy matter that is being brought to this House. A very serious matter of this nature, laid before you and before us, must be supported by substantial evidence. This places the integrity of this House at stake. If this is taken lightly, we know very well that this National

Assembly has many challenges. We are being fought from all over. A matter of such magnitude must first give priority to Hon. Wamboka to defend himself before us, followed by the evidence presented. In that Commission, we often sit in different committees. Those people fight back. When we stand to bring justice and order, they fight back. These may be some of the ways they are fighting back.

I am, therefore, pleased that the matter has been brought before you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. We would kindly request that serious evidence also be presented for your consideration and judgment. Otherwise, if we continue destroying one another one by one, a great house is reduced brick by brick and, in the end, it will collapse. I support the Members who have stated that we cannot rely on rumours. We cannot base our actions on rumours. Hon. Jack Wanami Wamboka is a very honest man, with dignity from the county he comes from. We are preparing him to become a governor in the future. We do not want such matters to tarnish him. When I say future, I do not mean this election, but any other future election. Whoever has made these allegations must present sufficient evidence. As a son of the soil, I wish to place that on record. Do not fight one of us.

Thank you for giving me this opportunity.

I am giving priority to Members of the Committee and so, I will give the Member for South Imenti, Dr Shadrack Mwiti.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I take this opportunity to concur with the Members who have expressed their views on this matter. I know my Chairman very well. He is a person of integrity. This matter appears to be targeted at an individual. Committees discuss various issues, and this particular Committee deals with commissions that misappropriate public funds. Before this matter was brought to the House, there should have been valid proof and evidence. The Member in question is one with a future, a Member we look up to in this country. I would like this issue to be ventilated by more people before we malign the name of the Chairman. We look forward to fair treatment of this matter.

Thank you.

Thank you. Hon. Osoro, I know you have to travel and so, I will give you an opportunity even though you are not a member of the Committee.

Thank you very much, Hon. Deputy Speaker. We need to be very careful in how we handle sensitive matters that are brought before this House. There cannot be a chairman without a committee. One cannot refer to a committee on one hand and isolate the chairman on the other. A committee is made up of many members. When assessing an individual's integrity, we must also consider the integrity of the other members. One cannot accuse a committee in its entirety without specific evidence. From the contributions I have heard, several Members of that Committee have spoken, and I have been keen to note whether there is a single Member who says: “I sent or I was with the Chairman and he went and solicited some funds from this other area.” Instead, they have consistently affirmed that they operate as a Committee of integrity.

I am particularly interested in the origin of this complaint. The Commission in question is coming to an end, and the Chair is exiting. As we speak, there is a new nominee, Bishop Omae, who will take over when the current leadership exits. Is the good man of God going down with the entire Commission when he is exiting? We must be careful, as we may find ourselves engaging in what amounts to mob justice. This is mob justice on the Floor of the House. The proper procedure should have been for the leadership of this House to take up the matter, investigate it discreetly, invite Hon. Wamboka and his team to provide evidence, hear both sides, and then decide.

Even having this statement read on the Floor of the House is, in itself, inappropriate. This is not the correct procedure for such matters. The Committee in question comprises

Members who are nominated by top parties of this House, including the Jubilee Party, the ODM Party and the UDA Party. If we publicly accuse the Chairman, then logically we would also have to question the Vice-Chair and the entire Committee. It is unreasonable to assume that a Chairman could act alone without the knowledge of the others. Unless the Chairman is some sort of demigod that everybody fears, which I highly doubt. As colleagues in this House, this is not the correct approach. The House Business Committee should handle this matter. It should be addressed privately, evidence presented, and both sides heard. We cannot accuse a Member before hearing their side of the story. It is fundamentally wrong, whether we like him or not. Today it is him; tomorrow it could be someone else. The rules must be followed. This matter should not be handled in the Plenary. It should be addressed in camera for the integrity of this House. This, in my view, is the wrong procedure.

Thank you very much.

Proceed, Hon. Okello.

I thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. This is a very serious and grave allegation that has been presented before this House and yet, it appears to lack cogent evidence. You are a lawyer of great repute, Hon. Deputy Speaker, and you understand that issues concerning the conduct of a Member must be supported by evidence. When Government agencies do not wish to appear before committees to answer for their imperfections, it becomes easy for them to resort to actions such as this.

This House has, on various occasions, faced similar accusations. Last year, even the President of this country made allegations that a certain committee and its members were soliciting funds, although no specific committee was named. He further claimed that there were individuals acting as welfare representatives within committees. No evidence was presented, the matter died, and now this.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, when people are staring at the next round of elections, such allegations will come forth to besmirch characters of individuals in this House, with a view to putting them down in the next round of elections. If we allow this to fester or to see light of day, I can assure you that all committees in this House, together with their respective Semi-Autonomous Government Agencies (SAGAs) that they superintend, will present similar allegations against Members of this House. Therefore, it behoves this House, at this nascent stage, to kill this baby together with the basin, so that no busybodies will emerge with allegations that are not backed up by evidence.

We are not saying that everybody here is beyond reproach, like the Caesar's wife. But even if there are certain questions surrounding their character, that must be based on sheer evidence, without which this matter must be taken to the back burner.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, you have what it takes to give a direction that will not only kill this matter, but also send a warning to busybodies out there that this is not a House that is on sale or a House which you wake up one morning and throw allegations at without Members fighting back. We will fight back over the integrity of this House, and we will be here to defend our colleagues. Just as was said in one particular episode, when they went for the journalists, we never responded because we were not journalists. When they went for the judges, we kept quiet because none of us was. When they came for us, there was no one to defend us. Therefore, we must defend Hon. Wanami Wamboka, not because he is a Member of this House, but because the allegations that have been levelled against him cannot be backed up by a shred of evidence.

I thank you.

Women Representative for Narok County, Hon. Rebecca Tonkei. I think you are also a member of the Committee.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I stand to distance myself from that report which, up to this point, is an allegation. I am hearing

that allegation from the National Cohesion and Integration Commission (NCIC) from my colleagues. I sit in that Committee. The Committee which has really worked hard and delivered many reports in this House since we got elected, is the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education, led by none other than Hon. Wanami Wamboka.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, there is a rule of natural justice. It would have been prudent for the Member, my Chairperson, to be heard before the allegation is brought to the Floor of the House. That would have been fair and just to him. It is very unfair to bring such an allegation to the Floor of the House and for his constituents to hear that he is corrupt without giving him a chance to defend himself. I request this Honourable House, led by our leadership, to give Hon. Wamboka a chance to be heard. Let the one who has alleged this bring evidence of what they have said so that this House can stand and say that this is true. But, without evidence, we are not going to allow that because today it is Hon. Wamboka, and tomorrow it will be another Member, and it will go on record that this is a House of corruption. It is unfair to ourselves. I request that this matter be dealt with accordingly, without any prejudice or political inclination.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

Thank you. Member for Kitutu Masaba, Hon. Clive.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. Whenever we address this House, we usually say: ‘Honourable Speaker’, and just by that, we have addressed the House. Anyone who comes to a committee that we sit in addresses the Chair of the Committee and, as such, has addressed the entire Committee. Therefore, this allegation does not just address and accuse the Chair of the Committee, but the Committee as a whole, without a single piece of evidence.

I am lucky to have seen what the complainant had written on that piece of paper, which is dated July 2025. Where was that document for Hon. Kaluma to write to this House in April 2026? What is inspiring Hon. Kaluma to write nine months later? The document was addressed to the leadership of this House and it was received. What is new about this that has inspired our colleague, the Member, to write and specifically pinpoint the name of the Chair instead of addressing the Committee as a whole? We will not allow political differences to come to this level, where we start targeting each other individually, instead of taking collective responsibility as a House and as committees. We should not allow our political differences to go this low. It is not a long time ago when we were accused to be a House of soliciting bribes. No evidence was produced and the issue disappeared silently. Any time we differ, we will be pinpointed.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, we will always have differences. Some of us will always have our stance. But it will fall below us if it reaches a point where we start mudslinging and trying to tarnish each other's names. Let us differ in ideologies. Let us fight on ideologies without targeting other Members by tarnishing one Member's name. I have always heard the Speaker saying that when we mess the name of this House out there, none of us is safe. None of us is seen in a different lens. We are all seen in the same lens. If today Hon. Wamboka is accused of things he did not do, all of us take the fall with him. None of us walks out clean. We will all be seen as solicitors of funds.

Hon. Gisairo, you are debating the matter. There is no Motion before the House yet. This was just a Communication from the Chair. I am just sourcing for comments and then we can move on

Hon. Deputy Speaker, we ask that this matter follows the line of Hon. Osoro and be looked at in a different Sitting from this.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

Hon. Pukose.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker, for allowing me to comment on the Communication from the Chair. This is my third term in this

Parliament and nothing like this has ever happened. This is setting a precedent. I urge us to look at it. The Committee on Powers and Privileges should investigate this matter so that the two parties, that is the Chair, Rev. Kobia, can table evidence before the Committee and Hon. Jack Wamboka to be given an opportunity to respond to those allegations.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, I think you are asking us to comment on how we should proceed since this Communication has come. I think Hon. Kaluma is also an interested party because he has written to the Speaker and made comments to it and the allegations are against the Chair of the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education, Hon. Jack Wamboka. We should not continue debating this matter; we should let it rest so that the allegations can be investigated through the proper procedures.

I rest my case, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

I think there are just two other Members who have requested to comment on this, and then we can come to a close. Hon. Phylis Bartoo, I see you have pressed the Intervention Button. Do you want to speak on this matter? After you, we will have Hon. Dido Raso.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I also wish to weigh in on this matter and condemn it in the strongest terms. It is very unfortunate that someone can write such a communiqué to Parliament, tarnishing another Member of Parliament, particularly at a time when we are approaching elections.

When you have your own differences, you should sort them out elsewhere, not in an honourable House of Parliament like this one. This case is similar to what we see in newspapers, where Members of Parliament’s photos are displayed, alleging they have misappropriated the National Government Constituencies Development Fund (NG-CDF) funds and yet, Members of Parliament are not even signatories to that docket. It is not right because there is no proof; it is just propaganda and yet, it is spread across the entire nation. This tarnishes peoples’ reputations.

We should end this discussion and not let it get to the premises of Parliament again. We should wait for the relevant bodies to conduct their investigation to prove that it is true. It takes two to be corrupt and so, the question is: How did the one reporting know that there was corruption going on? I do not support this.

Let us be honourable Members. Whenever there is such an issue, let us use other channels to clear our names. It is not right to come and start tarnishing each other. We are honourable Members and leaders that are elected by our constituents. We represent the people. So, when one stands and tarnishes a Chairman of a Committee, it implies that the entire constituency is corrupt. We need to address this case.

Thank you. Hon. Dido Raso.

Thank you very much, Hon. Deputy Speaker. Indeed, if a communique comes from the Chair concerning a Member of this House, it simply states that, that individual has been condemned without being heard. This House has enough structures, including the Liaison Committee. The Speaker has enough structure around him to elicit views on such issues as they arise. When anybody in this House is mentioned, in this case Hon. Wamboka, that goes straight to his constituency. The constituents are up in arms, listening to what is happening. This should not be confined to him; it can happen to any of us, not necessarily on this particular matter, but on many other issues that can arise in the course of human discourse.

The issue of complaints against a Member or even a chairman should have been addressed appropriately within the structures of Parliament before they come to the House. It is unfortunate that this has happened. Hon. Deputy Speaker, you and the Speaker, with the help of the Clerk, can still retrace back and find an amicable position on this. Democracy is such a beautiful thing because anyone can complain to Parliament. However, when individuals do

complain to Parliament, they must be careful not to injure the character of Members, without due follow-up, even where there is sufficient evidence. This is really water under the bridge, and it can still be salvaged.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

Thank you. Lastly, let me allow the Nominated Member for Meru, Dorothy Ikiara. I have seen Hon. Wamboka in the House. I will also give an opportunity, and then we will close this.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I agree with all the Members on the sentiments they have expressed this morning. The million-dollar question is: Why did it take so long for the allegations that were brought to the Leadership of this House in July 2025 to be communicated in April 2026?

Secondly, the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education is the committee that audits our education institutions. Without beating around the bush, we are aware that there are various governance issues in a majority of our learning institutions. It is not every time that one will sit and pamper people when there are issues. One has to raise those issues, and I do not think they are always taken very well. The Chairman has to affirm the Committee’s recommendations, thus making him a target.

If we allow this to continue, this House will be completely crippled, as it will mean nobody will be able to raise issues with anyone. The integrity of this House must be safeguarded. Let the relevant structures be followed so that we do not condemn Hon. Jack Wamboka, a much-respected Member of his community and of this House.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, you are a very senior lawyer. Please advise on how we will move forward. The integrity of this House must be protected.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

Hon. Wanami Wamboka, would you like to say something? Proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker, for giving me this opportunity. First, I want to appreciate this House for giving me the opportunity to serve as Chair of the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education for now going to four years. It is not easy to be in an audit committee, be it the Public Investments Committee on Governance and Education or the Public Accounts Committee, because we deal with real issues and, at times, we bite.

I think I saw that letter from Hon. Kaluma last week on Thursday, a letter that was addressed to the Speaker of the National Assembly ten months ago. In the wisdom of the leadership of the House, no action was taken due to the lack of any associated evidence. As long as this House is in the business of auditing, many such letters have come, many continue to come and many will come. What motive did my colleague have against me? On whose behalf was he acting? Because even as a lawyer, one needs a brief. In whose interest? I would like to ask anyone who has personal differences with me to resolve those differences elsewhere, but not to drag this Honourable House into matters of disrepute.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, I have served with dignity. My Committee sits for long hours. We have produced more reports than any audit committee ever has in our time. We have done our work well. What provoked this? I want the House to know that the NCIC is an independent commission. It has the administrative wing led by the Chief Executive Officer, which is doing a fundamental job. The Chief Executive Officer and the team of directors are doing a very good job. But the commissioners of NCIC, who left office almost seven months ago, have issues that they need to respond to before this House.

A few months ago, the same Commission appeared before the Senate Committee on National Cohesion, Equal Opportunity and Regional Integration. When the Chief Executive Officer was pressed, he said that the commissioners had pushed him to employ their children

and relatives, twenty-two individuals in total. These are the issues we are auditing. When we audited the NCIC last week, we discovered that the commissioners had misappropriated funds to the tune of Ksh132 million. This is on record. These records come from the Auditor-General; they do not originate from the Public Investments Committee. They are facts from the Auditor-General that those individuals misappropriated funds meant for the smooth running of that organisation. They used funds without any approvals.

We have invited NCIC three times. They never came. The first time we invited them, we were sitting at the Holiday Inn. When they came and saw the issues raised by the Auditor-General, they literally ran away. They have never been audited. They have refused to be audited. The Committee that I chair directed last week that the former commissioners must be brought in for auditing by this House, even if it means being arrested by the Officer Commanding Station (OCS) of the Parliament Police. These are the issues we are dealing with. Personally, I have never met the commissioners. They have not attended the audit and, therefore, it is wrong to say that the Committee has intimidated them or that the Committee is soliciting money. For what, Hon. Deputy Speaker? I am sure that the leadership of this House, in its wisdom, recognised when that letter arrived that there was no evidence associated with it, and that is why the matter was not pursued. However, how it has arisen now. Your guess is as good as mine.

I have known Hon. Kaluma for a very long time. I play football with him. But even with Jesus, if anyone had told you before it happened that Judas would betray Him, you would have said no. That I leave to God. As for why Hon. Kaluma may want to tarnish my name, and who is using Hon. Kaluma to tarnish my name on issues that are in black and white, that is also something I leave to God.

It is the Office of the Auditor-General that conducts audits and brings us that information. The information is in black and white; it is glaring. I presented it to this House, and this House adopted the reports of my committee. So, where lies my problem? Hon. Deputy Speaker, where is my problem?

Lastly, I find it unfair on the part of the leadership of this House. As we audit every day, people will be aggrieved. People will want to run away from justice. People will want to circumvent the justice system. These letters will keep coming. Why was it not deemed necessary to call me? Nobody has called me. Nobody has asked me anything, Members. Nobody has said to me: “Hon. Wamboka, as Chair, this matter is here. What is your opinion?” Nobody. I consider that to be in bad faith. Such a matter should never have reached the Floor of this House. Today it is Wamboka. Tomorrow it could be Hon. Clive. The other day, it may be the Speaker. We cannot allow this.

I call upon this House to reject this letter and return it to the sender, as it does not merit any debate in this House. I thank all the Members who have spoken on this matter. I appreciate all of them. You have seen the mood of the House. We cannot allow this to go on. We should not, and we should never have permitted it to escalate to this point, as it damages the reputation of individual Members and subsequently undermines the reputation of this House.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, I hope you will find it within your wisdom, having listened to Members of this House, that this matter should never have come before us and that it should end here. I will seek out Hon. Kaluma behind the curtains to understand why he would want to do this to me.

Thank you.

Thank you, Members. Having had the comments on the complaint against the Chairperson of a House Committee, a complaint based on serious allegations made by the outgoing Chairperson of the NCIC, and also upon the request of Hon. Kaluma, who is one of our Members, I will take stock of what has been said by the Members and then issue a direction in due course.

Next Order.

There is a notice of Motion from the Member for Nyeri Town, Hon. Duncan Mathenge.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I wish to give notice of the following Motion:

THAT, aware that Article 53 (1) (b) of the Constitution guarantees every child the right to free and compulsory basic education and Article 21 (2) obligates the State to take legislative and policy measures to ensure the progressive realisation of socio-economic rights which include the right to education, under Article 43 (1) (f) ; further aware that, the Basic Education Act (Cap. 211) obligates the State and school administrators, to ensure equitable access, retention and completion in basic education and prohibits administrative barriers that exclude learners; noting that, the Children Act, requires the best interests of the child to be the primary consideration in actions concerning children, including in education; recognising, Kenya's international and regional obligations under Articles 2 and 28 of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, Article 13 of the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights, Article 11 of the African Charter on the Rights and Welfare of the Child and the United Nations Educational , Scientific and Cultural Organisation (UNESCO) Convention against Discrimination in Education, which requires States to ensure education is accessible, non-discriminatory and free from economic and social barriers; concerned that certain administrative practices in schools, particularly, compulsory sourcing of uniforms from designated outlets, exclusion of learners for inability to pay for school feeding programmes, remedial class charges or other non-statutory levies, have the effect of imposing economic and administrative barriers and in some instances, creating possible avenues for abuse of office and improper financial benefit; now therefore, this House resolves that:

We can go to the next Order, if there are no comments.

There was a request for a Statement by Hon. Nabuin, Member for Turkana North. It will be responded to by the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure. Hon. Kibet was supposed to respond on behalf of the Chairman.

I had not seen the previous page. There is a Question by the Member for Nakuru Town East. Hon. Gikaria, you have an Ordinary Question.

I have a Question and a Response.

Proceed.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 42G, I rise to ask the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission (IEBC) the following Question:

That particular Question will be placed before the Departmental Committee on Justice which oversees the IEBC. Is there any Member of the Departmental Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs to give an undertaking on how soon it will be provided? Hon. Waqo, do you want to give an undertaking on behalf of the Committee, taking into account that we will be going for recess from the end of next week?

Most obliged. We will do that and see if they can respond by next week. If not, we will provide a response after recess.

There was a request for a Statement by the Member for Turkana South, directed to the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure.

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I wish to make a correction: I am the Member for Turkana North Constituency, not Turkana South.

Hon. Deputy Speaker, pursuant to the provisions of Standing Order 44 (2) (c) , I wish to request for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure regarding the routine maintenance and spot improvement of the Lokitaung - Kibish Road and the Lokichogio - Lokitaung Road in Turkana North Constituency.

The two roads, branching from the Juction of Road A1, constitute critical infrastructure corridors within Turkana North and Turkana West Constituencies. They serve not only as an essential lifeline for the local population but also as strategic gateways to the Ilemi Triangle and vital arteries for cross-border trade with Ethiopia and South Sudan.

However, the condition of these roads continues to deteriorate due to prolonged neglect, thereby inflicting profound economic hardship on the people of Turkana North Constituency. Local traders and pastoralists endure exorbitant transport costs, frequent delays and excessive vehicle wear and tear, all of which erode their meagre margins. Perishable goods, particularly fish from Lake Turkana, suffer massive post-harvest losses owing to protracted journey times and near total absence of reliable cold chain facilities thereby, restricting supply to major markets that include Nairobi.

Given their importance, the roads need to undergo routine maintenance, regular grading, enhanced drainage systems, and comprehensive anti-erosions. It is against this background that I request for a Statement from the Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Transport and Infrastructure on the following:

Thank you. Any Member of the Committee to give an undertaking on timeframes? Give Hon. Kibet the microphone. He is right at the back to your right.

Thank you. Could we give a response a week after recess? We can invite the Member in that meeting.

You can send out the request for a Statement to the relevant ministry now then it will be available by the time we come back from recess.

Most obliged.

Next, we have a response to a request for a Statement that Hon. (Dr) Oundo, Member of Funyula, requested. The Departmental Committee on Energy will respond. Hon. Gikaria, it seems like Hon. Oundo, who is the owner of the Statement, is not here. Usually, the precedent is that it will pass. Give Hon. Gikaria the microphone.

Thank you. It is true that Hon. Oundo is not around. He is a frequent Member of Parliament in the House. Would you allow we give a written response? This is the third time I am here. I even went to the Table Office yesterday to request that it be scheduled in the Order Paper. I could give the written response if it is possible. We will take it from there if he is not satisfied.

Just give him the written response. He can always raise a point of order at the appropriate time if he has any comments.

Most obliged, Hon. Deputy Speaker.

Thank you, Hon. Gikaria. You can table the report to the House just for record.

Next Order.

Can I have the record of who was speaking and who has any balance of time? We have a balance of 34 minutes on the debate.

Hon. Harrison Kombe was the last person speaking but he had no balance of time. He had completed. Members who would like to contribute to this amendment Bill, please press the intervention button. Hon. Dorothy Ikiara.

Thank you. I stand to support the very important Bill that the Member of Parliament for Laikipia County, Hon. Jane Kagiri, brought to this House. The Bill is very clear on what it wants to achieve. We take our children to school. We implore them to pursue various disciplines. We have invested in Technical and Vocational Education and Training (TVET) institutions heavily. It means this country is not short of manpower and jobs to secure.

The Bill is speaking to our country because it aims at ensuring that all investors in the country employ 60 per cent of the local people in their companies, from the lowest to the highest. Currently, foreign entities employ 20 per cent of our people in their factories while the rest are foreigners. We keep saying that we need jobs for our youth. It is high time we actualised and ensured the Bill passes, and is assented into law. We are asking the President, His Excellency (Dr) William Samoei Ruto, to ensure this Bill vindicates us or stands in the gap for the youths and locals to secure 60 per cent of jobs. Occasionally, we have seen our local employees being mistreated in their own country. There is an incident where a Chinese foreigner was seen battering a young innocent employee in his hotel. That was among many other incidents that have happened unnoticed and sometimes, unreported.

It is high time we secured jobs for our children and thought of how to expand the labour market locally to accommodate all the children we have encouraged to go to TVET institutions and other higher learning institutions to undertake disciplines required in organisations.

[The Deputy Speaker (Hon. Gladys Boss) left the Chair] [The Temporary Speaker (Hon. Martha Wangari) in the Chair] Hon. Temporary Speaker, we have foreigners coming to our country who when they want to insure their vehicles, homes and even their lives, they do so abroad instead of doing it with our local insurances. This Bill has come at the right time so that we can be able to support our young men and women. We are not short of people who have gone through education and they have secured themselves very good papers. They have come out with excellent skills in whatever discipline they are required to. Let us come out as a House and support the Bill that has been fronted by Hon. Jane Kagiri. It is timely, and the right thing for this country. We will take this country far if we support the Local Content Bill.

Thank you.

Very well, Member for Moiben Constituency. Not on this. Member for Nandi Hills Constituency, Hon. Bernard Kitur.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to contribute on this very important Bill in our nation sponsored by Hon. Jane Kagiri, County Women Representative for Laikipia. The Bill comes at a time when we have had challenges in our country where foreign companies and institutions that invest in our country, many times, want to source goods or services from abroad, locking out the local Kenyans who also need to be given the opportunity to participate in building and supporting those companies because they have the power and the ability. However, many times, they are undermining local industries and Small Medium-sized Enterprises (SMEs) in our country. They are being gagged and not being given the opportunity to also contribute in facilitating foreign companies that are operating locally and as well, building their own economy.

Hon. Jane Kagiri comes from that region. For instance, there was a time we were being told that some foreign company around used to import potatoes across the seas yet they are locally available. If farmers are trained or given the right seeds, they are able to produce equally or even goods or services of much better quality. They can even do better from Kenya. Since there was no legal framework that would then lock in the foreign companies and investors to have local participation, the Bill comes at the right time because there would be need for foreign investors locally, to give a percentage. I have seen the provision that the investors should ensure

that at least 60 per cent of services, supplies and goods, are sourced from local companies. This is very good because it is also going to build the capacity of the locals so that if foreign companies have particular standards they need to maintain for their goods and services they want to be supplied locally, then we will be able to improve our local business community. I will support this because it is going to support businesses across the country, whether it is Nairobi or other parts of the country, so that they can be able to meet the standards at the international level.

I do not want to belabour much. I came here today just to support the Bill and congratulate Hon. Jane Kagiri for work well done and the extreme research she did. It is extremely timely. You are going to change the lives of many and we are going to improve the quality of living of the business community in our country

Thank you very much. I support.

Very well. Member for Nyeri Town, Hon. Mathenge.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I stand to support the Bill. To demonstrate this, I want to use the examples of two state corporations. One is Kenya Electricity Generating Company (KenGen) in power generation. KenGen has perfected technology transfer, including in the area of geothermal, we have seen it use local expertise to go and conduct and implement projects on geothermal power generation and electricity generation in Ethiopia.

On the other hand, allow me to use Kenya Pipeline today, which has a monopoly in oil and fuel storage. Despite the years of existence of Kenya Pipeline and the level of technology advancements, including training in our national polytechnics, training in KenGen’s own Morendat Technical and Vocational Education and Training (TVET) institution and training of engineers at the degree level in our universities, Kenya Pipeline still outsources the work of maintaining the fuel storage tanks, including welding, to foreign companies. We keep saying that there are no jobs for our middle-level technicians and technologists as well as our engineers. Therefore, it is critical that we have a resolution of this House, backed by a legal framework and a policy change, that will command that actually 50, 60 or even 70 per cent of projects being implemented in this country have to have the local content guaranteed, both in terms of use of expertise, technology transfer and the use of locally available materials so that the local communities that are hosting the projects can have a sense of ownership.

In fact, I would like to push this a little bit further and request Hon. Jane Kagiri to consider affirmative action so that even out of that 60 per cent…

Member for Laikipia, it is good to pay attention to what Hon. DMM is saying.

A certain percentage of the 60 per cent should be locked for the host community. I will use the example of the geothermal plant in Olkaria. Out of the 60 per cent that is locked for local content, 10, 15 or 20 per cent is also locked for the host community around Olkaria so that it can start becoming meaningful to the host communities. They do not just see the smoke. What is the effect of the smoke or the vapour that escapes?

You can also use an example of Eburu in Gilgil, which never gets anything from energy.

That is another one, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Hon. Jane Kagiri, you have put great effort but in your final submissions, please ensure that, just like we have British Army Training Unit Kenya (BATUK) in Nanyuki, what content of the BATUK contract benefits the host community in Nanyuki besides the rest of the country?

This should not just extend to international contracts but even to local contracts. I have a case where the tenders for cabbages for Kiganjo Police Training College are being issued in Nairobi. So, how is it cheaper to transport cabbages from Marikiti to Nyeri rather than purchasing cabbages from Chaka Market, which is less than half a kilometre from Kiganjo Police Training Collage? Bread tenders are issued in Nairobi. Why is it cheaper to transport bread from Nairobi to Kiganjo, yet a gentleman famously known as Wanguku bakes bread just half a kilometre from Kiganjo Police Training College? The Cabinet Secretaries and Principal Secretaries must stop claiming that we are politicising matters. Local host communities have a stake. Even as the rest of the nation benefits, those communities must receive affirmative action consideration, so that such projects can make sense.

During the construction of the Standard Gauge Railway (SGR), local suppliers received a 30 per cent reservation, but were shortchanged in the implementation of the same. Therefore, I call upon the Committee on Implementation to follow up on the resolutions made by the House to ensure their implementation. The Committee should stop dropping the ball. The

Committee on Implementation should be compelled to table a matrix outlining the

Let us have the Member for Matungulu.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. First, I thank my sister for bringing this Bill. It is high time that host communities benefit meaningfully from multinational investments on the ground. Hon. Mathenge has mentioned many examples, but I will give the example of KenGen, which generates power from the Seven Forks Dam in Ukambani. Despite this, some parts of Ukambani still lack electricity. Also, while Masinga Dam generates power, local communities lack adequate water for farming. We should fast-track this Bill to ensure that local communities benefit from such kinds of interventions by the House.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, since you sit in the Speaker’s Panel, I urge you to ensure that these interventions are implemented. It is not a request. In the 10 years that I have been a Member of this House, the Committee on Implementation has never tabled a matrix or report on how the resolutions made by the House are being implemented. We enjoy taxpayers’ money through salaries and benefits, so that we can better the lives of Kenyans. This Bill represents the kind of legislative action that we should encourage.

Numerous multinational companies engage in cement and steel production along the Athi River Corridor. Those activities should benefit host communities and counties. Are those companies doing so? It is high time that we passed this Bill to ensure that the 30 per cent reservation for the host communities proposed by Hon. Kagiri is implemented to the letter and across all companies. We cry that the “basket” is shrinking and it is true. The cost of living continues to rise, but we still need more money to cushion Kenyans. This is one way of raising money for the host communities.

I support this Bill and urge Hon. Kagiri to follow up on it after its assent. It is our duty to ensure that the Committee on Implementation gives us a clear timeline for implementation. That is critical because passing laws without implementation is a waste of time. Hon. Jane Kagiri, take it upon yourself to follow up with the Chairperson of the Committee on

Implementation to ensure that we get a report on how the law will be implemented in every multinational company.

Look at a company like Del Monte Kenya Limited, which occupies vast tracts of land in Thika, Murang’a and parts of Ukambani. What benefits do host communities receive? Very minimal. Instead, they have turned boys who are trying to survive into pineapple scavengers. If caught, they risk being jailed. If proper programmes were put in place to benefit the local youth, the impact would be significant.

I urge the leadership of the House to demand a report from the Committee on Implementation on the implementation of all the laws that have been passed by this august House since its inception in 2022. That is where we are failing. We are doing a lot of good work but implementation remains a challenge. I will accompany Hon. Kagiri to the Committee on Implementation to find out how they plan to implement the Bill. The Bill will not only benefit the people of Matungulu and Baringo but also the entire country, especially the youth. By implementing such policies, we can create jobs and reduce unemployment.

I support the Bill.

Members, the Mover should reply to the Bill in two minutes, but I will indulge the Member for Chuka/Igambang’ombe. If you keep your contribution short, we will be on time.

Hon. Patrick Ntwiga (Chuka/Igambang’ombe, UDA) : I will keep it short, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

I rise to support the Bill. As my colleagues have said, we have sold out our job market to foreign workers. While there is nothing wrong with having foreigners in specialised roles, it is concerning that even basic jobs are being taken over by foreigners. Today, if you walk around town, you will find many workers from neighbouring countries in kinyozis and spas where our young boys used to shave us or in salons where our young girls used to work. We have given out to foreigners the manual jobs that our young people should be doing. The Government has insisted on TVET. In my constituency alone, we have over 8,000 students in TVETs, with approximately 2,000 graduating this year. Where will they go if even technical and manual jobs are going to foreigners?

Even in terms of importing products, every supermarket today now stocks eggs, processed meat and even rice from China. Meanwhile, farmers in Mwea are trying to find markets for their rice yet we have plastic rice from China. It is high time we protected our economy, supported our people and created opportunities for our youth. Unemployment is a major contributor to hunger.

I strongly support the Bill and congratulate Hon. Kagiri.

You are right on time. Hon. Jane Kagiri, it is time to reply.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I will start by thanking my colleagues for the great support they have shown towards this Bill. I want to assure them that I have taken note of their contributions and they are going to see that as we go to the Committee of the whole House. Hopefully, we will eventually see this Bill being assented to.

In my reply, I want to remind Members that the United Nations Conference on Trade and Development (UNCTAD) Report of 2024 indicated that in the year 2023, the foreign direct investment in Kenya was US$1.5 billion. The foreign direct investment outflow that same year was US$1.3 billion. What I am trying to indicate is that we are left with only US$200 million in this country after all the deductions. What we are doing is just emptying water from one bucket to another bucket then claim that we are doing something, yet nothing is left in our country. In the same year 2024, the Competition Authority of Kenya also released a report

which indicated that 90 per cent of the trucks in this country are owned by Kenyans. However, 70 per cent of all contracts by multinationals go to fellow multinationals. These are the equalities that we want to fight for. How can we be owning trucks and we do not qualify to get tenders? We must ensure Kenyans are given opportunities.

If I may take you back to China when it started doing its high-speed rail, it engaged France, Germany and Japan. Part of its requirements was that these countries must facilitate a skills transfer before they exit their country after that tender. Today, China is the leading constructor of high-speed rails all over the world. That is because they received the skills transfer.

I appreciate all the proposed amendments from Members, like the proper definition of “local content” and “foreign company.” We will consider the penalties that we should have and the committee’s proposal to have a local content compliance authority.

Let me give special thanks to the Member for Matungulu and the Member for Nyeri for giving us an introduction to something that we had not thought about in this Bill. We have to further protect the local host communities even as we speak about local content as a republic. I must also appreciate Hon. Amina Mnyazi, the Member of Parliament for Malindi who brought in the tourism angle. We have hotels in Malindi that only employ cooks as foreigners. Everything is foreign in those hotels. We must protect our people; we must give them opportunities to serve.

Allow me to add what I have collected from my research. Many multinationals claim that they give us business because they buy our fuel. The Bill will protect us from that. Fuel is not a local product from Kenya. Everybody who fuels their car in the country wants to claim that they are giving us business on fuel as a country. We will not accept that.

Many people have wondered if the Bill is going to cause any investment flight. It is good that I assure everybody that countries that lead in foreign direct investment have more stringent laws than our country. So, if investors are comfortable following laws elsewhere, then they should also be comfortable in following laws in our country. During our public participation, many investors gave their contributions and they said that they require a rule book where when they come into our country, they will know what is expected of them or not expected of them.

We must also change our attitude as Kenyans. Anytime we talk about skills from Kenya or products from Kenya, Kenyans always ask if we are qualified. This Bill and the research that I have done should clearly tell Kenyans that we are even overqualified. It is only that opportunities are not protected for us. As I indicated when I was moving the Bill, this is a ‘buy Kenya, build Kenya’ mantra in form of a law. We want to ensure that we no longer live on goodwill. We can protect our people.

I am a great reader of the good book, the Bible. In the Bible, God talks of us loving our neighbours. However, in the same Bible, God has no pleasure in fools. We are good neighbours to other countries and we observe all our treaty agreements with them. However, do they extend to us the same generosity? We must put Kenyans first as we go into these trading blocs, treaties and agreements that we have.

As I conclude, it is good that I take this Honourable House back to the year 2014 when the Communications Authority of Kenya introduced a regulation that 40 per cent of broadcasting on Kenyan media houses should be Kenyan content. If you may remember, we all went berserk wondering what we will be watching and what local content will look like. Today, what looked impossible is now at 94.6 per cent compliance. This is a Bill that can be complied to. It is a Bill that people can honour. It is going to ensure that Kenyans get job opportunities and we become a competitive country like other countries.

I beg to reply.

Very well. We shall defer putting the question on this Bill to the next appointed time.

Next Order.

Hon. Nzambia was on the Floor. He had a balance of six minutes. I do not see him in the House. So, I will give the chance to the Member for Laikipia East. He is also not in the House. Hon. Bartoo, are you on this? I need to know if you have indicated that you want to speak on this Bill. Hon. Bartoo had already spoken. Members, if you intend to speak to this Bill, kindly use the intervention button. Hon. Mule.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I stand to support the Prevention of Livestock and Produce Theft Bill, 2023 co-sponsored by Hon. Dawood and Sen. Samson Cherargei. I come from a constituency that neighbours Nairobi and a number of my constituent rear livestock. I want to bring to the attention of this House that the Bill is extremely timely to the people of Matungulu. This week, incidents of livestock theft happened in Matungulu because of the heavy rains that are going on. That was on Monday evening and yesterday evening. Such incidents demoralise small-scale farmers who rear livestock to support their families.

Yesterday I got a call from one of my constituents, Mr John Bosco Mwema Muthengi, who had only seven cows, telling me that at night when it was raining, thugs stormed his residence and stole all of them leaving him with nothing to depend on. This guy is not employed and he depended on his livestock. So, we need to take this Bill seriously.

You know, this country has suffered a long history of cattle rustling in the pastoralist communities. It is high time we support the Bill to encourage county governments. This is a job dedicated to the Chief Executive Officer in charge of livestock in each county. They need to come up with mechanisms that will prevent, combat and eventually eradicate livestock theft in counties.

If we take our roles seriously and make sure that this Bill is passed, like the previous Bill that we have debated, and implemented to the letter, it will wipe a lot of tears from the Kenyan livestock farmers who have suffered from livestock theft. The Bill has put a lot of emphasis on branding. I want to request Hon. Dawood to liaise with the co-sponsor of the Bill… With the new technology in the world now, if we want to help our farmers with branding that the Bill is talking about, we should make it electronic branding and tracking of cows.

Kenya Wildlife Service (KWS) has embraced branding by tagging lions and elephants so that they can track them wherever they are. If the counties implement the same and tag cows using electronic devices, a helpless farmer, like my constituent, John Bosco Muthengi Muema, who lost seven cows yesterday, could have traced them electronically. The police and ASTU could have known where those cows were.

The Bill also addresses registration and design of branding. These are the responsibilities of county governments. We call upon county governments to implement some of these interventions which do not cost much. The county governments are spending colossal amounts of money on programmes which do not have effect on the common mwananchi. I support this Bill because it clearly gives lifeline and protection to the local farmer. The contents of this Bill do not only affect the small farmers in our constituencies but all of us. I rear cows in numbers. Sometimes it is very difficult to identify all of them. So, it is high time county governments looked at interventions which mean business to a local farmer in the livestock industry.

The livestock industry is a lifeline in Kenya in that, for example, a local farmer with at least 10 cows can be assured that his children will go to school. This is because at the end of every year, he can sell a cow to pay school fees and remain with something for the family. If he has cows which produce milk, he can be sure that his family cannot starve because in the morning and evening, there is production of milk for consumption. This milk is also healthy for our children in Grades 1, 2 and Pre-Primary classes.

We need to support this timely Bill but we should relook at the offences. I urge Hon. Dawood, being the co-sponsor of this Bill in this House, to look at some of the penalties he is proposing because they are low. For example, if you have a fine of ‘not exceeding Ksh100,000’ and a thief has walked away with Hon. Kiunjuri’s 100 cows, he will sell only one cow to produce that Ksh100,000 then sell the remaining 99 at a higher value. We must enhance the penalties to make sure that we deter these criminals from continuing with the mess of livestock theft. I agree with the penalty of ‘not less than 20 years’ because if, for example, the thief is in his early 20s and he is imprisoned for 20 years, by the time he comes out he will not have the energy to drive the herd all the way to the market.

There are many beneficial proposals in this Bill. The other issue the Bill advances is on transporting livestock using trucks. If you drive along Mombasa Road on a Tuesday, I can assure you that you will meet more than 30 trucks ferrying livestock to Nairobi. It is high time the traffic officers and law enforcement team made sure that those trucks have proper licences for transporting livestock and, if possible, a manifest of the number of sheep, goats and cows they are carrying and where they got them from. That is the easiest way to stop this movement. When theft happens in remote areas of this country, a truck is stationed in a river bed nearby then the livestock is loaded and transported to Nairobi where there are too many slaughter houses. In fact, the Bill should also address the issue of the slaughter houses in this City.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I request that you add me only two minutes.

I add you one minute, Hon. Mule.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. We need to seriously address the issue of slaughter houses. When we were growing up, the only slaughter houses which were authorised to slaughter cows were fully controlled by the local government. Today, if you go to every town, slaughter houses are mushrooming and we do not know whether they have veterinary officers, control systems or licences to operate.

I thank Hon. Dawood and Sen. Cherargei for this Bill. It is high time we addressed livestock theft through the law. Those who are benefiting from this business of livestock theft should be taken to court and held accountable through the law. There should be no escape route.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support.

Very well. Hon. Mwangi Kiunjuri.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. From the outset, I appreciate this timely Bill. My position is very clear that I support the Bill. Looking at the history of this country on Bills that have been enacted and the existing laws, you ask yourself where the rains started beating us. Why are farmers suffering to date? This is a timely Bill. However, we can propose too many good laws but if we do not appreciate and

enforce them, then they will become pieces of paper. If you look at what is happening in the country, mostly in the isolated areas, then you must acknowledge that one cow stolen from a poor farmer in Laikipia and 100 cows stolen from a rancher in Laikipia, instil the same pain.

I am very happy that the counties have a bigger role to play this time round. It is very important for the county governments and national Government to move forward and ensure that this practice comes to an end. For example, my county borders Samburu, Isiolo, West Pokot and Baringo counties. There are real issues of livestock theft in these counties. If, before the law enforcement officers come in, we have our own arrangements between our neighbours and ourselves, sit down and talk, we can regulate issues of livestock theft. However, it becomes difficult when the issue of well-established cartels comes in. Livestock theft is more of a trade than petty thieves.

Sometimes, you wonder how you can drive 1,000 or 100 head of cattle, they disappear somewhere, not in the forest but on a plateau, and they are never recovered. Where do these people take these animals? Yes, there are hiding places where they can hold these animals for one or two months. However, at the end, there will be a market for these animals. When it comes to enforcement of this Bill, it is important that we come out clearly and name cartels or those involved. It is a big trade. Before we address that, whatever we try to bring up will be futile.

For example, there are small-scale farmers who own one cow in Nturukuma, Laikipia East Constituency. They have been suffering for the last eight months. People come every night to steal 20 chickens and one goat, and then they slaughter one cow. At the end game, you ask yourself where the market for 20 stolen chickens is. If one goat is stolen, where is the market? There is evidence that it was slaughtered. This brings in the issue of eateries. These are the small and major joints in towns where this meat or stolen products are sold.

When it comes to identification, we also need to go deeper and understand how to track down those eatery joints so that we can establish their sources of meat. You wonder how a joint is opened today and you do not see these people in the slaughter yards buying meat, but they are permanently supplied. Where do they get their supplies from? This can only be done in conjunction with enforcement officers who do not care and those who are supposed to track down the thieves. Lastly, you understand that there is always collusion between enforcement officers and the thieves. I believe that by enforcing this Bill, we will have better laws in this country.

We must achieve our intention and purpose. We should ensure that farmers and traders are not targeted in the implementation of this Bill. This is because it will open another Pandora’s Box. Instead of enforcement officers implementing the law, they will take advantage by receiving bribes from the same thieves that we are trying to protect ourselves from. We must make sure that the farmer in the village is well protected. The marking of animals should not be an exercise in futility. We must ensure that when it comes to marketing, the actual problem is sorted out.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, counties must also be empowered. The national Government, in a joint venture, should ensure we have a proper tracking technology and the effectiveness is felt across the board. This will make people understand that if they are caught in a community trying to push the question of theft or working in collaboration with whoever is doing it, there will be serious consequences. If this issue is well addressed, we will take care of those families which have been improperly impoverished.

If a family has one cow and then you steal it, you deny them livelihood, in terms of what they eat daily. If a person has only five goats and his child is chased out of school, he can sell one goat for Ksh15, 000. This is enough money to pay school fees for a day school for a whole year. However, when we sit here, we think that one goat is nothing to those farmers. If a farmer has five goats, he can educate his child in a day school from Form 1 to Form 4. He

only needs to sell one goat. At the end of the year, the goat that was left can give birth. In the process, the five goats will sustain that family in five years. We must make sure that this law is applied in the right way for that farmer with one goat and the other one with 1,000 goats, so that Kenyans will understand the economic part of it.

Lastly, it is good to be fair, sensitive and transparent, and ask the county governments to take their responsibilities seriously because of the movement from one county to another. Even if you are walking from one county to another, you can be monitored. Once we mark these animals, we shall know that an animal comes from a certain county or village, and it must be protected properly.

I would also like us to sensitise those counties that practise livestock farming, so that we do not cause tension. For example, we have Samburu and Laikipia counties. Everybody who moves from Samburu to Laikipia does not have bad intentions, and everybody who moves from Laikipia to Isiolo does not have bad intentions. Therefore, we should also have public participation and sensitisation, so that we can know when we have free movement, the urgency of it, when to allow it, and not just free movement without respecting boundaries.

With those few remarks, I once again support this Bill. It will take us another step in the right direction. Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support the Bill.

The next chance goes to the Member for Marsabit County, Hon. Waqo.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to support the Prevention of Livestock and Produce Theft Bill. I also congratulate the sponsor and co-sponsor of the Bill. It will help livestock farmers who have suffered in the hands of criminals and bandits because they have nothing that can protect them. Just reflect on the life of a simple livestock farmer who has 50 or 20 cows, with no bank account or other business, and the entire family depends on the livestock. Most of the time, livestock farmers cannot even afford to buy themselves a pair of shoes. They also cannot afford to dress well and live better lives. All they know and all they have are the cows, goats and camels. They take care of those animals religiously such that if drought comes, it is like death sentence is given to them. Unfortunately, livestock farmers have suffered because of cattle rustlers who attack them.

I come from Marsabit which has suffered for many years. You keep a few animals, the attackers come and then they run away with them. Before they go far, they can sell them, board a bus, and then they go back to their counties or stations. The county security team always says that we should follow the footsteps, see where they have passed and then we go to the village, and make sure that they produce the attackers. However, it has never happened. In fact, the last incident that happened in less than two months ago claimed the lives of two people and about 14 animals were shot dead because the attackers were rough. They also ran away with the remaining animals. That happened like 40 to 45 days ago. The attackers were 16 people. Two of them died and from their identification documents, it was established which villages they came from. Unfortunately, up to today, the remaining 14 attackers have not been identified and the police have not even given us any update.

I visited the two families. They lost all the animals and their bread winner. The family is still young. One mzee has young sons none of whom is employed. They are just there not knowing what to do next. The other one is a National Police Reservist (NPR) . He has a young family. His first born is less than seven years old and his last born is one-year-old. He lost his father under the same circumstances. He also lost his grandfather in the same village. If you visit that village, you will see all the three graves. It is a very sad thing. It is the responsibility of any Government to protect the lives of citizens and their property. This Bill will solve that problem.

This Bill provides a legal framework for the identification of livestock. It may be costly but it will help. My prayer is that the county government will give this Bill all the attention it deserves. This will ensure that all the animals are identified. They will have the mark through which the owner or the security team can use to follow and bring back the animals in case of any loss.

This Bill will also take care of the movement of livestock. As I told you, previously the security team and the local elders used to follow the footsteps without knowing what to do. Sometimes they get into the forest and reach a point where they cannot go beyond. This Bill will help us know the movement of livestock from the moment they leave their village up to wherever the animals will be taken. The Bill will serve as a measure of preventing livestock theft. By putting all these control measures in place, we will prevent the theft of animals.

On regulation of trade in livestock, sometimes animals taken from one village in Marsabit, Isiolo or somewhere else, will be sold here in Dagoretti. People will consume the meat while the owner is suffering or already dead and buried. So, by doing this, we will control every animal movement. We will know where the animals are, control the trade, and make sure that the animals do not go beyond a certain stage. If there is anything that will benefit our livestock farmers, it is this Bill.

On the issue of the attackers, the rustlers, and the fines, we need to put more severe penalties, so that if you are found guilty, you can even be imprisoned for the rest of your life. This is because you have destroyed somebody's life, people's businesses, and families. There is no way you can just be taken to prison for 10 or 20 years. Let it be life imprisonment so that these people know that the moment they commit such crimes, they will face the law.

I support this Bill. It is my prayer that, soon, our President will assent to it. That will give us relief, especially pastoralists.

Very well. Member for South Imenti.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker for this opportunity to contribute to this auspicious Bill. It is long overdue. I thank the Members for having endeavoured to bring it here.

This Bill has clear objectives, especially to strengthen prevention of livestock theft. We know livestock theft has been a traditional thing. It has been there since time immemorial across tribes, especially along the borders. Recently, we experienced a lot of livestock rustling between the Samburu and the Meru in Meru North. It is not only in the northern grazing areas that this activity is practised, rather it is also in areas where high grade animals are kept. There, animals are stolen for slaughter. The introduction of measures to curb cattle rustling and related crimes is very vital, especially where we will have legal measures implemented.

One of the objectives of this Bill is to enhance surveillance and monitoring of livestock movement. Livestock movement should be monitored from one region to another, especially where security authorities have roadblocks. We realise that most of the livestock stolen are transported at night. It is the duty of the security to stop or hinder any livestock movement at night. Enhancement of security in rural areas is very critical. We should have police monitoring the movement of animals at night. Improving coordination between the security agencies and the communities should be overemphasised to monitor the animals’ movement.

Promotion of community policing activities is very important. This will enable the community to protect themselves where security officers are not available. To regulate these community policing activities, livestock and produce trade should be monitored. This will ensure that the markets where these animals are sold are monitored very well. That way, the administration will know the origin of such livestock.

We should really strengthen the issue of enforcement of penalties. In fact, we need to introduce stricter penalties for offenders. Very strict penalties should be imposed, especially

long-term jail sentences, or fines that they may not afford. The cattle rustlers, or thieves should not leave jail and practise the same. We should treat theft and related criminal activities as very serious matters. We must also promote the use of technology.

Encouraging livestock identification systems, such as tagging, tracking systems, and branding, makes it very easy to identify those animals whenever they are found in the market. We know very well that, especially in rural areas, animals are stolen and then taken to butcheries for slaughter. At times, it is difficult to identify those animals after they are slaughtered. We should really be able to emphasise the ways of identification so that we improve the traceability and recovery of the stolen livestock.

Cattle rustling is not merely an activity but a business cartel that markets these animals, probably even outside the country. Where several animals are stolen in large quantities and cannot be traced, it indicates a market. It is very important that the market for these animals be identified. Establishing buffer zones between various tribes is also very important, especially between Isiolo and Meru, where cattle rustling is rampant. We emphasise to both the national Government and the county governments that they should now identify the buffer zone areas.

It is very important to note that this activity is being encouraged by the poor response from the security operations. This can be capped, especially where we have implementation and enforcement capacity enhanced, with adequate resources in the security agencies, specifically where we have vehicles, ammunition, and personnel available. Resources are key to success in any particular activity. Cross-border coordination is very important. The parties across the border have to coordinate at a very high level so that parties on both sides of the border are able to coordinate. We know technology is responsive, but the cost of technology adoption is very important for security reasons, mainly because the livestock that is owned by these people is very important.

Let me take this opportunity to concur with this particular Bill. Thank you very much.

Member for Samburu County, Hon. Pauline.

Thank you, Honourable Temporary Speaker, for giving me time to add my voice to this very important Bill. Being a Member of Parliament from the pastoralist community, I think this is a very important Bill. It will regulate the livestock sector, which has experienced a lot of challenges, problems, and conflicts for a long time. This Bill is going to harmonise the livestock sector because we have had a lot of challenges and a lot of conflicts between communities. This specific Bill will cause prevention, combatting, and eradication of animal theft, which has promoted insecurity and a lot of instability amongst our communities. We have had a lot of inter-community conflict because of animal theft, and in the process we have lost very many people.

If I take an example of Samburu, we have had a lot of inter-community conflict along the Suguta Valley and communities bordering Suguta Valley in Samburu. These communities have never gone even for one moment without a raid in the valley. A week cannot end without us experiencing people coming from Suguta Valley and along Baringo to raid in Samburu, where people have settled to do farming. People have always lost properties and lives yet recoveries have not been done to date.

If animals from every country are branded and labelled, then stolen animals will easily be identified and returned. This kind of process can help us stop this kind of business, which has really become a terrible challenge in our communities. We have seen people from Meru complaining that people from Samburu have been attacking them. This Bill is going to cure such problems. All the counties must also be brought into the picture so that they support and identify all the animals in their specific counties. They should have branding for every county so that people can easily identify and even control the market. We have even had camels stolen from particular counties and being sold in others.

When security officers come, they will arrest an innocent person who would have unknowingly bought a stolen animal in the market. Because of the law, you will be caught as a thief, yet you just went to the market and bought an animal. This will also cure our market trading, because animals have been transported from very far. They are stolen and transported to far places. They are being sold even here in Nairobi.

I want to thank the Member who has come up with this Bill, and I hope that very soon the President is going to assent to it, so that we help the pastoralist counties. There has been a lot of conflict, banditry, killings, and loss of property in these counties. We need to harmonise the livestock sector in the country because it is the main source of livelihood for our people. If the Government cannot come in to regulate this sector, we are going to get many problems. Counties blame each other. People come from different places to kill others and take their livestock. They leave behind innocent families in a very desperate situation.

There is an operation going on to recover stolen livestock from Meru in Samburu. We are not against the security operation that is going on, but I want to ask the security officers who are conducting the operation to do the operation in a way that is humane because it is not everyone who has gone to steal. Let them go for the bandits, but respect the lives of innocent mothers and children who do not know where the road to Meru is. I am sure the security officers will know how to locate the bandits.

What happened in Oldonyiro is very unfortunate. People purporting to be conducting an operation just went, found animals grazing, confiscated all of them, and brought them as stolen livestock. That was the case and yet from observation, those were animals which were grazing. It is known where the bandits took the stolen animals. They were driven into the interior, towards Mukogodo Hills, where the officers were not able to pursue them. There is no need to make innocent people suffer in the process of recovering stolen animals. Go for the stolen animals! Do not make everyone suffer in Samburu because of the ongoing operation.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Hon. Mathenge.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Listening to our friends, one might think that livestock theft occurs only in pastoralist communities. However, it is more devastating for a small-scale farmer in areas such as Kamakwa in Nyeri, Kihuyo in Mathari, Muthua-ini in Nyeri Town Constituency, who only has one dairy animal. When that animal is stolen, their entire livelihood is lost.

The land sizes in Nyeri Town are small. For instance, my parents are on a settlement scheme that was allocated to them back in the 1970s. They own three acres of land. When their sons settle and start families, you can begin to see what is happening. Those are families that cannot even keep one cow. They either have goats or, at most, chicken but even these small livestock are stolen.

In this day and age, how come in places like Solio Ranch, we are able to protect rhinos, elephants, giraffes, lions, and rare antelope species in the Aberdare Forest and Mount Kenya regions using satellite technology deployed by the Kenya Wildlife Service (KWS) , including in conservancies in Laikipia and areas bordering Samburu and Baringo, yet when 100 goats or cattle are stolen and driven through the forest cover, they cannot be traced? Why can we not leverage the same satellite services and Global Position Systems (GPS) tracking technologies that are used by the KWS? We repeatedly allocate funds for livestock restocking. Between restocking and the installation of GPS chips that can be monitored using satellites and mobile apps, how come it is easier to purport to support families that have lost their livestock rather than use modern technology to protect them from livestock thieves?

We have the Anti-Stock Theft Unit (ASTU) yet since its establishment, we still rely on footprints to trace stolen animals. Why not retool this unit and enhance its capacity? How many

helicopters does it have? I trust that Hon. Dawood will listen keenly to the proposals that we are making, so that this Bill can be improved to protect us. I have livestock being stolen in Nyeri Town Constituency and sold in Othaya, Mukurweini, and Mathira, despite the presence of police stations with Officers Commanding Stations (OCS) and Officers Commanding Police Divisions (OCPDs) in these areas. How is this possible?

Hon. Temporary Speaker, it is because people in authority, possibly even within this House, are beneficiaries of these atrocities against our people. That is why they cannot agree to have their livestock tagged. Some serve in the ministries, like Interior and National Administration, some in county governments and they have large holdings with large numbers of livestock. That is why they will not allow funds to be allocated for GPS tagging for the use of satellite technology. We pride ourselves on launching satellites into outer space. How are these satellites serving our people who have elected us to this House so that we can protect them?

Hon. Dawood, please, improve this Bill. I am ready to sit with you so that we can see the kind of amendments we should make. Since we have agreed to have a co-sponsor, let us not have a protracted battle between the Senate and the National Assembly in terms of going to mediation. If we need to go to mediation, let us go early enough so that the benefits of this Bill can accrue to our people.

Further, all the catering establishments have single business permits from the county governments. It is high time we insisted, in this Bill, that catering establishments that serve meat products must have a written contract with the supplier in a format that is accountable, so that we can ensure that these catering establishments are not the market for stolen livestock. There is high suspicion that they actually are.

Lastly, there is the aspect of transport. How come every lorry, motorbike and Probox can transport animals to the market? Until we address the issue of transporting either live animals or meat products in this Bill, we will still have a gap. I support this so that we can protect our farmers from these thieves. When livestock is stolen - the entire herd that a family relies on for their livelihood - is that not an economic crime? Hon. Dawood, why do we not import the penalties under the Economic Crimes Act into this Bill? We must leverage existing laws so that crimes are treated equally, whether it is the theft of a single cow from a family in Nyeri or the loss of 1,000 head of cattle in Maasai, Samburu, or the North Eastern region.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I support.

Very well. Member for Magarini. Mhe. Harrison Kombe (Magarini, ODM) : Asante, Mhe. Spika wa Muda, kwa kunipa nafasi nami nipate kuongeza sauti yangu kwa Mswada huu.

Ni Mswada ambao umekuja wakati unaofaa. Hakika wafugaji wengi wamepoteza mifugo yao hasa wale ambao wako Magarini. Wamepoteza mifugo yao kupitia kwa majirani ambao hufuata malisho. Wakati wa kurudi kwao wanahama na mifugo ya wafugaji wa Magarini. Hili limefanyika hivi majuzi ambapo mfugaji mmoja alipoteza ng'ómbe wake thelathini na wawili kule Chakama. Ni jambo la kusikitisha kwamba amepiga ripoti lakini hakuna taarifa yoyote kufikia sasa ambayo imeweza kutolewa na idara ya usalama. Bado anahangaika. Iwapo kila kaunti itakuwa na alama yake spesheli ambayo ikionekana tu inajulikana hii ni kaunti ya Kilifi ama hii ni Garissa, itakuwa ni rahisi kuwatambua wanyama wale ambao wameibwa. Na kama wamenunuliwa kutoka kaunti ya Kilifi, kuwe na stakabadhi ambazo zinaonyesha kuwa huyu mnyama amenunuliwa kutoka kaunti ya Garissa.

Mhe. Spika wa Muda, alama hizi ambazo ni za kutambulisha wanyama ziwe ni za kudumu. Pasipokuwa alama za kudumu... Ikiwa ni kuweka rangi tu kulingana na teknolojia ya kisasa, inaweza kufutwa wakati wowote na ikawa bado huwezi kumtambua mnyama wako aliyeibwa. Ingawa hivyo, kwetu kuna vile tunaweza kuwatambua wanyama ama hata wanyama wanaweza kutambua mfugaji wake kwa majina. Nikitoa mfano, kuna mfugaji mmoja ambaye

ameibiwa mnyama wake na akaenda akampata kichinjioni, akaulizwa amemwekea alama gani, naye akasema hajaweka alama yoyote lakini, 'Twende pale kando kisha mimi nitasema maneno na huyo mnyama atakuja mwenyewe hapa'. Walipoenda kando, kweli, alipoongea yale maneno na kumuita yule mnyama, mnyama alitembea mpaka pale alikokuwa, akasimama naye. Akawa amethibitisha hilo. Kwa hivyo Mhe. Spika wa Muda…

Mhe. Kombe, ni majina ama ni ushirikina?

Siyo ushirikina; ni majina tu. Si suala la ushirikana. Kwa mfugaji ambaye yuko na tajiriba ya kutosha, anaweza kuwapatia wanyama wake wote majina na akawa anawaita na wanakuja sawasawa na vile yeye mwenyewe amewazoesha. Kwa hivyo Mswada huu naona hata tumechelewa kuupitisha. Tuupitishe haraka iwezekanavyo iwapo kutakuwa na marekebisho, tuweke ambayo itakuwa ya kusaidia wafugaji nchini Kenya. Kwa hayo mengi Mhe. Spika wa Muda, ninaunga mkono Mswada huu.

Very well. Member for Chuka/Igambangómbe.

Hon. Patrick Ntwiga (Chuka/Igambangómbe, UDA) : Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. You know speaking after Hon. Kombe you are tempted to speak in Kiswahili, but I might embarrass myself.

Only do it at your own risk.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I stand to support this Bill and mine will be very brief. One, I reiterate what Hon. Kiunjuri asked. How do you explain how somebody disappears into thin air with a herd of 1,000 cows? Investigations are done and the police tell us that they cannot get a report about 1,000 cows that have disappeared. Initially we thought cattle rustling and stealing of livestock was specifically happening in pastoralist communities. In my constituency, especially during the rainy season, the biggest problem my people are facing… I do not know why the Member for Runyenjes is looking at me as if the cows disappearing from my place are taken to his place.

owners have been killed and their livestock stolen. So, there is something we can implement with good labelling and documentation.

We should also ban transportation of cows at the night. I wonder where these lorries carrying 1,000 cows pass through because with the current check points that the county governments have put, you cannot leave one county to another and eventually arrive in Nairobi or Mombasa. So, having county governments at the centre of this will also help us because they have check-points all over. You cannot leave or enter a county without being checked. They have ensured they have stops in all the routes that get out of a particular county. There is no way a lorry will pass in the night with cows and they only pick cess without knowing where the cows are coming from or where they are headed to. So, having the country governments at the centre of this Bill will really help us to end cattle rustling. In addition, there is need to mark cows, and take charge of eateries, butcheries, and slaughterhouses to ensure that if a cow is slaughtered, there should be documentation about which county you bought if from and the relevant marks of that county.

I support this Bill.

Member for Manyatta.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I also rise to support this Bill knowing very well the crisis and the conflicts that are brought about by cattle theft. We have seen a rise in theft of livestock in areas such as Meru that used to be very calm. While we are looking at labelling cows and making sure that they have identity, there is also a need to look at what really makes the trade of cattle theft thrive. This is a cartel system that is well oiled, well connected and also politically instigated in some places. As we support this Bill, I sympathise with the people in Meru who have lost lives and livestock recently, in areas neighbouring the northern side.

We also need to say that the Anti-Stock Theft Unit has also come under scrutiny in its operations in a way that it is also compromised sometimes, when it comes to looking at this issue of livestock theft. However, I also want to say that it is at this moment where the Ministry of Interior and Coordination of National Government has completely lost trust from the people of Meru and the northern side. We have found out that even after livestock is stolen… And it is clear that this is a politically instigated issue and, therefore, the investigation will not get anywhere. Many people have lost their lives because of this issue. The livestock end up in slaughterhouses in Nairobi without questions on how they were acquired.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, as I support this Bill, I call upon the Ministry of Interior and National Administration to allocate more resources towards addressing the issue of livestock theft. It is also unfair that every day we witness the misuse of police officers during demonstrations. In my county, at Ishiara, we lost two young men who we shall bury on Friday and Saturday. They died while fighting for a better healthcare system at Ishiara Level 4 Hospital, which is currently on its knees. The young men were shot dead by police officers using live bullets. Their families are crying. Over 10 bullet cartridges were collected by the Independent Policing Oversight Authority (IPOA) . These are the same police officers who allow livestock theft to thrive in this country because it is profitable and makes a number of people very rich.

I wonder what the Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration will tell this House when it comes to the misuse of police officers. We have seen the use of police officers at political rallies that are calm, while the same officers are unable to protect cattle and people in Meru and other places like Baringo.

I know that many Members support me. The only problem is the status of this House when it comes to dealing with serious matters like proposing the impeachment of the Cabinet Secretary with immediate effect because he has failed in his duty. He should not be speaking when it comes to issues to do with security.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Hon. Kawanjiku, what is out of order?

It is a big shame.

There is a point of order by Hon. Kawanjiku.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Can the Member for Manyatta substantiate what he means by saying that the status of this House is known? Can he substantiate and declare what the status of this House is?

Hon. Mukunji.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I have just indicated that two young men in Ishiara lost their lives through bullets. I also said that 10 cartridges were collected by IPOA at the site. The Cabinet Secretary has no mandate to continue saying that he is in charge of the Ministry of Interior and National Administration when livestock theft in Meru and other places continues.

Hon. Mukunji, I heard you clearly. However, the issue raised by Hon. Kawanjiku is on your statement about the status of the House. That is the issue I would want you to respond to.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, I will repeat what I said. The status of this House is that we have a broad-based system that has made it very hard to get Members to support something that is against the Government. That is a fact. I have substantiated my claim.

Do not respond to him. In my understanding, you have made your point. Continue with your contribution.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, as I conclude…

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

Hon. Mathenge, what is out of order?

Under the Standing Orders, it is a requirement for a Member to be relevant to the matter being discussed. What is the relationship between Hon. Mukunji going to a public rally and the Prevention of Livestock and Produce Theft Bill?

Member for Nyeri Town, you are not being fair at all. He is in order to talk about things that are happening in his county, including his constituency. Hon. Mukunji, take your time. Keep to the rules and the Standing Orders. You are doing well so far.

My good friend from Nyeri Town should not show lack of knowledge of the procedure of this House.

Do not answer the Member. Continue with your contribution to the debate.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, this House has the teeth and the mandate to ensure that taxpayers’ resources are protected. Public resources are used to buy every bullet used against Kenyans. Every gun a police officer holds and uses to shoot at a Kenyan belongs to Kenyans. I speak from a point of pain because I was on the ground to see what the people of Ishiara were looking for. All they were saying was that their

hospital was in a horrible state. They were calling upon the governor to act. We still do not know who instructed the police to shoot those young boys. We need to crack the whip on the Cabinet Secretary. We should call him to order and impeach or discipline him. The House has the power to do so. We have dismissed every single security issue, including people being shot in church.

On a point of order, Hon. Temporary Speaker.

What is out of order, Member for Kiambaa?

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. The Member for Manyatta knows the rules and regulations of this House. He cannot insinuate that the Cabinet Secretary of Interior and National Administration should be impeached yet he has not moved a Motion to discuss the conduct of the Cabinet Secretary. He should not be speaking as though he is at political rally. He knows the rules and procedure of this House. Can he bring a Motion and see whether we will support it? He should not try to discuss somebody who is not in the House to defend himself.

Members: Point of order! Point order!

Members, there is no one on the Floor. Why are you raising points of order? Hon. Mukunji was actually done. There is nothing out of order right now and there is no one on the Floor. Listening to Hon. Mukunji, he did not say that we are impeaching the Cabinet Secretary. He said that we should. Everyone has his or her opinion. You cannot prosecute an impeachment the way he said it. We know the process of an impeachment. You will have your say if there is an impeachment Motion on the Floor.

The time for this Order is up. I would like to call upon the Mover to reply but there is still some interest. I will use my discretion to allow two Members to contribute to the debate. I will allow the Member for Ndaragwa and Member for Wajir West to speak and then the Mover will reply. Before the Mover replies, he may donate a part of his time to a few more Members to speak to the Bill.

Hon. Gachagua, proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I will be very brief knowing that the time is limited. As I support the Bill, I would like to suggest to Hon. Dawood that we improve the clause on owners of abattoirs. I would like us to include a requirement for abattoir owners to hold livestock delivered to them for more than two days before slaughtering them. There should be a required to establish livestock holding paddocks so that once villagers realise that their animals have been stolen, they can rush to the abattoirs to identify their animals before they are slaughtered. The issue of livestock being taken to abattoirs and being slaughtered immediately may be contributing to cattle rustling. In Ndaragwa, the problem has escalated significantly. Animals are stolen, and within an hour, slaughtered just a few metres away from the households.

This Bill, emanating from the Senate, will be more effective if it is implemented at the county level. The county administrations can designate livestock holding where they can position their askari to guard them, especially at night. Anyone transporting meat at night should be questioned about its origin. So, instead of only stating that animals should not be sold between 6.30 p.m. and 6.00 a.m., let us add that before an animal is slaughtered, it should be held for one or two days. This will allow anyone whose animals has been stolen to go to the slaughterhouses and identify them.

Member for Wajir West, proceed.

Thank you very much, Hon. Temporary Speaker, for giving me this opportunity. I rise to support this crucial Bill. I come from a constituency where animal theft is rampant. My camels were recently stolen by bandits and

taken to Laisamis in Marsabit County. I have done everything possible, including reaching out to the Cabinet Secretary for assistance, but even the police have been unable to recover them. At one point, the police recovered six camels and took them to their station but the bandits, later on, attacked the station. They opened fire and took all the animals again. Nothing has happened to date. This kind of animal theft is what this Bill, as proposed by Hon. Dawood, seeks to address. It will go a long way in helping to address the situation. First, it will enable tracing of animals and identifying the regions they come from. Secondly, it will help in disease control by tracking the origin of outbreaks like foot-and-mouth disease and identifying affected areas.

It is also important to note that stolen animals are often slaughtered and sold to butcheries without proper records. With proper traceability, records can be maintained at every butchery, and the person who brought the animal can be identified.

With those few remarks, I support the Bill. I would like to donate two minutes of my time to Hon. Jalang’o.

Member for Wajir, you cannot purport to donate time. You are not the Mover of the Bill. However, I note that there is still considerable interest in this Bill. Allow me to give Hon. Karemba two minutes. Hon. John Paul will also have two minutes, considering what is currently happening in Meru and Isiolo counties. The Members for Borabu and Langata will also have two minutes each and then the Mover will reply.

Hon. Muchangi Karemba (Runyenjes, UDA) : Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I would like to support this Bill from the outset and state that losing even one cow or one goat is a significant loss to any family. I have reservations about people who present livestock theft as a cultural practice as though it should be accepted on that basis. This country is governed by laws, and theft is a criminal offence. Those who steal animals under the guise of cattle rustling and describe it as a cultural activity are engaging in criminal conduct. Therefore, even as we legislate further to address this problem, the Government and the Ministry of the Interior and National Administration have a duty to act. Embu neighbours Meru County. Lately, cattle rustling has become a serious menace in that area. Only the Government of Kenya can effectively address this problem. There have been success stories in other parts of the country where cattle rustling has been contained. The same can be achieved in Meru County and in other affected areas. Even as we introduce more laws, Kenya is not short of laws to deal with this issue.

With those few remarks, I support.

Hon. Mwirigi, you have two minutes.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I also rise to support this Bill. This legislation comes at the right time, as the people of Meru County are suffering from cattle rustling. Each week, people are killed as their cattle are stolen. Once stolen, the animals become untraceable. It is difficult to understand how herds of 200 or 500 animals can disappear without trace. This Bill seeks to address that problem by enabling the identification of animals, particularly through electronic devices that can be installed on livestock. This will make it possible to trace animals whenever theft occurs.

Additionally, the issuance of movement permits is important. The grazing land in Northern Meru has diminished. When animals disappear, they often end up in markets where they are sold without trace. If movement permits are properly regulated, for example, within limited time frames, tracking such animals will be easier.

This is a good Bill and I support it.

Member for Borabu, proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I rise to support the Bill as I align myself with my colleagues, Hon. Gitonga Mukunji and other Members. This menace of cattle rustling is no longer confined to remote areas. My constituency, Borabu, faces the same problem. Today livestock is not moved on foot. It is transported using Probox vans.

Secondly, the issue of livestock movement permits needs review. If a permit is issued to move an animal from one county to another, it should take not more than a day. Issuing a permit valid for seven days creates room for manipulation and misuse, including facilitating further theft. I support the Bill and emphasise that cattle rustling is a criminal act. It should not be trivialised as a cultural practice. It is organised crime. In the process, people lose their lives and their livelihoods.

I particularly support the sentiments expressed by the Member for Chuka/Igambang’ombe. This problem is no longer confined to marginal areas. It has become a commercial venture affecting abattoirs and villages alike.

With those remarks, I support.

Member for Langata, proceed.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. Members like Caroli Omondi, who do not know that all the cattle stolen in the rural areas end up in butcheries and on our plates in Nairobi, are asking why I am talking about cattle rustling in Nairobi. Every butcher or person dealing in meat must be able to trace the person who supplied them with the meat, if required to do so. This is one of the amendments that should be introduced to Hon. Dawood's Bill. That way, we will be able to trace a criminal act from the time cattle is stolen and taken to abattoirs and butcheries. As Hon. Osero said, cattle theft is no longer traditional cattle rustling. It is a criminal offence and must be treated as such.

With those few remarks, I support.

I now call upon the Mover to reply.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I appreciate all the Honourable Members who have spoken to this Bill and the suggestions they have made.

I will start with the last suggestion by Hon. Jalang’o. It is already in Clause 15 of the Bill. It is a requirement for all abattoirs to have records of whoever supplies animals to them for slaughter and whoever takes them, be it the owner or somebody else. That is covered. What the Member for Ndaragwa, Hon. Gachagua, talked about is also covered in Clause 15.

Regarding the complaints made last week and this week by the Member for Buuri, Hon. Mwirigi, and Hon. Mukunji regarding the security apparatus, Clause 4 (d) of the Bill says “…in collaboration with security and other relevant agencies, establishing mechanisms for disarmament and confiscation of firearms and ammunition illegally held by livestock owners.” This is one of the most important clauses of this Bill. Cattle rustlers or livestock thieves use sophisticated guns. The other day raiders stole from Meru County. Officers from the Anti-Stock Theft Unit and other security officers who were on the ground could not match the raiders’ ammunition. It was very difficult. It was like the Sylvester Stallone Movie, Rambo, where they came with sophisticated guns. We fail to understand where they get them from. This Bill seeks to deal with that menace.

Last week and this week, an issue was raised regarding application and whether livestock owners who own 200,000 or 300,000 herds of cattle will be able to afford branding. This Bill also addresses that aspect. County Executive Committees (CECs) will take care of that matter as highlighted in Clause 6 (c) . Branding will be accompanied by a prescribed fee. The Committee rejected that proposal because there is a proposal in Clause 36 (2) (e) , which states that there will be no charges at the county governments but there will be charges and fees to be paid to the Registrar under the Act. The charge is not per livestock. It is per brand.

One other question was whether this is a money Bill. It is not a money Bill. No Exchequer issue will be needed to implement the resultant statute of this legislation.

I thank the Member for Samburu, Hon. Pauline, for supporting this Bill. However, I am not certain whether she is aware that her governor has raised concerns that may have incited reactions in Samburu in relation to Clause 19 of this Bill on cattle theft. She has rightly observed that it is not the whole of Samburu County that is involved in cattle rustling, and I fully agree. We should not blame the entire county. She also indicated that bandits from other counties pass through certain forests in Samburu County. In that regard, I request that, if she has the opportunity today, she discloses the specific forest routes being used so that the Government can take action.

The Member for Matungulu, Hon. Mule, said the proposed penalties are lenient. That is penalty intended for livestock owners who fail to brand their animals. For those who steal, the Bill states that one is liable, upon conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding one year or to a fine not exceeding Ksh100,000. Clause 19 further provides that cattle rustling attracts the same penalty of life imprisonment, similar to robbery with violence involving items like television sets or money. The proposed penalties are adequate. They provide that a person who steals livestock or livestock produce shall be liable to imprisonment for a term of not less than 20 years. It further provides that where livestock is stolen with violence or the threat of violence, the offender shall be liable to life imprisonment. Therefore, this matter has been addressed

Regarding the clause I had read earlier on payment, this has already been addressed under Clause 36(2). I am also glad that all the Members who have contributed have supported the Bill, except one Member, the Member representing Elgeyo Marakwet, who opposed the

Bill on the basis that there is no longer cattle rustling in her constituency and, therefore, in her

Members, for obvious reasons, I defer putting the question on this Bill.

Members, the time being 1.00 p.m., the House stands adjourned until 2.30. p.m.

Published by Clerk of the National Assembly