Kaluma George Peter Opondo

Next Question. Question 31/2025 OPERATIONALISATION OF ICHUNI POLICE STATION

Question 32, Hon. Peter. INSECURITY IN TAITA TAVETA

Cabinet Secretary, we have moved that way because we have urgent Business to transact after this one. You may now respond. The Cabinet Secretary, Ministry of Interior and National Administration (Hon. Kipchumba Murkomen) : Hon. Temporary Speaker, I would like to respond as follows to Question 029/2025 by Hon. Eve...

That one does not require a further response. Hon. Peter Nabulindo.

Cabinet Secretary, do you have something to tell Hon. Nabulindo? The Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration (Hon. Kipchumba Murkomen) : Let me quickly comment on Hon. Obara’s statement. We agreed that we needed to do something in Sondu. Once we visit the ground and see the need for...

I will allow only three of you one minute each because of the next business you have to transact. Cabinet Secretary, you will indulge us. You can take the questions straight away so that they are addressed. Hon. Nzambia.

Do you want to respond to it now, or can we create a forum for you and the Member? The Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration (Hon. Kipchumba Murkomen) : I think the Member is seeking further consultations because I have answered it thrice. To be very specific, this...

Cabinet Secretary, does that fall within your mandate, and are you ready to respond to the Question now? The Cabinet Secretary for Interior and National Administration (Hon. Kipchumba Murkomen) : I understand the struggle that my friend, Hon. Okello, is going through and I sympathise with his position. Because we...

Order! I like the matters you are raising. However, the report you are debating is not before the House. (Hon. Farah Maalim spoke off the record) Order! The promise made by the Cabinet Secretary is that he will help out, although the matter does not fall within the mandate of...

Order! Please, Members, it is not out of order for the Member to register his gratitude to the Cabinet Secretary for a job well done. Hon. Barongo will be heard in silence. You have one minute to go, Hon. Barongo.

For all Members who wanted to mention something about hardship areas, the directions given will stand in respect of all contributions you wanted to make thereon. Cabinet Secretary, you can see the interest the Members have in raising matters with you when you are in the House. First, it could...

Hon. Owen Baya.

Hon. Dido Raso.

Give him one minute to conclude.

Hon. (Dr) Makali Mulu.

Proceed, Hon. Naisula Lesuuda, on account of gender balance.

Hon. Eckomas Mutuse.

Hon. Member for Nyando, you will consult the Chair of Budget and Appropriations Committee, Hon. Samuel Atandi, in a low tone, particularly when we are transacting an important business on the Division of Revenue Bill. You cannot address him in that language that is not known to the House. (Laughter)

Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal, Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Health.

Hon. Keynan, do you want to follow Hon. Irene Mayaka or go first? On account of rank, you will be followed by Hon. Irene Mayaka. She will be followed by Hon. Mwenje. Let the Members be given the microphone in that order.

Hon. Irene Mayaka.

Hon. Mark Mwenje.

What is the matter, Hon. George Sunkuyia? Do you want to contribute?

Be upstanding, Hon. Members. Order, Hon. Sunkuyia. You will have nine minutes when the matter will be next listed by the House Business Committee for consideration in the House tomorrow. ADJOURNMENT Hon. Members, the time being 9.07

Next is Senior Counsel Stephen Mogaka, the Member for West Mugirango.

Thank you very much. Next is the Vice-Chair of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Affairs, Hon. Dido Raso.

Do you need more minutes? Give him three more minutes. You must be added time. (Hon. Members consulted loudly) I can see that some Members are concerned. Remember, these are not ordinary bodaboda motorcycles. These are bodaboda motorcycles used for e-hailing services. They are used for delivering drugs and food...

Next is the Member for Suba South, Hon. Caroli Omondi.

Do you need a minute or two? (Hon. Caroli Omondi spoke off the record) Give him one minute.

Thank you. Next is the Member for Matuga, Hon. Kassim Tandaza.

Thank you very much, Hon. Kassim Tandaza. Do I take it that there is no further interest in the Motion? We had requested that whoever wants to contribute to this Motion should press intervention but I see no request. Hon. Paul Biego, do you want to contribute to this? Please,...

The Chairman of the Departmental Committee on Health, Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal, do you want to contribute to this Motion? Thank you. Hon. Martin Owino, Member for Ndhiwa.

Hon. Members, as agreed, and there being no further interest from Members to contribute, I now call the Mover, Hon. Tom Joseph Francis Kajwang’, to reply.

Thank you, Hon. T.J Kajwang’, for stepping up for your Committee whenever duty calls. Before I call out the next Order, for the convenience of the House, the Question to this Motion will be put the next time it appears on the Order Paper for consideration. Next Order. Again, Members,...

Thank you very much, Vice- Chairman, Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security, for moving on behalf of the Committee. Now that the Chairman of the Committee is there, it is only in order that Hon. Gabriel Tongoyo seconds.

I have a natural bias in the context of this matter towards Members of Parliament from the mentioned counties of Baringo, Elgeyo Marakwet, Turkana, West Pokot, Samburu and Laikipia. From the Report, I note the Committee wants a lasting solution to the disturbed part of the North Rift. Remember also,...

Hon. Dido Raso, what is out of order?

Hon. Makilap, your time is up but because of the passion with which you pursue the matter and being from the area, I will give you two more minutes to wind up.

Hon. Gabriel Tongoyo.

Hon. Makilap, you have a minute to wind up. Remember you are operating within the gratis time.

Thank you, Hon. Makilap. Hon. Members, your contribution on this Motion is five minutes each. So, I would request Members who have information, like Hon Makilab, to liaise with the Chair of the Committee, so that we can pursue these matters. Hon. Kassim Tandaza? Mhe. Kassim Tandaza (Matuga, ANC) :...

Hon. (Dr) Naomi Waqo, the Member for Marsabit County.

Hon. Caroline Ng’elechei, the County Member of Parliament for Elgeyo Marakwet.

Nitakuongezea dakika moja ili umalizie maoni yako.

Ahsante, Mhe. Caroline Ng’elechei.

Hon. Lotee.

Hon. Lotee, are you saying an armoured personnel carrier belonging to the Government, carried people working for the Government to kill a chief, an administrator?

Hon. Cynthia Muge.

Hon. Lotee, the statement you have made, more so, concerning the involvement of police or national Government officials in the killing of a chief who was serving in the National Government Administration, is very serious. The request is that you substantiate.

We are not dealing with the fact of that public servant's unfortunate death. We are dealing with the fact you are talking about relating to who, in your view, killed him and the use of the anti-personnel carrier. Can you substantiate that claim?

If you insist you can substantiate the claim that anti-personnel carriers that are among the equipment the Government has deployed to the North to help with the security situation have been used by officers… You said NPR?

And that those together have killed another officer of Government? We can give you time, but if you are not sure, you can withdraw that part so that we can continue with the debate. I am telling you this to confirm that the Standing Orders requires you to substantiate any...

So, Hon. Lotee, you have requested time to substantiate. I hope you get clearly what requires substantiation within the meaning of the Standing Orders here. The claim that the anti-personnel carrier belonging to the Government, being part of the equipment of Government, has been used by an NPR, also deployed...

Let me also direct that that part of the statement be expunged from the Hansard, so that it does not incite emotions in terms of triggering Government using its resources to fight Government officers. Hon. Lotee, you can continue.

Hon. Lotee, did I hear you claim that you can substantiate that fact?

Hon. Lotee, we have given you a lot of time because of the important matters you are raising. Hon. Members, this is a very emotive debate. I believe it will be continued tomorrow. Please be here so that we can get solutions. Every time I have had occasion to meet...

Hon. Baya.

Hon. Florence Jematiah.

Just a minute, Hon. Julius Melly. For known reasons, after you, I will give preference to our Muslim brothers and sisters.

Hon. Adan Keynan.

Hon. Gabriel Tongoyo.

Order, Hon. Ali Wario. Take your seat. The Hon. Chairpersons… (Hon. Wanami Wamboka consulted loudly) Hon. Wamboka. (Loud consultations)

Let me caution, Hon. Wamboka, that the Standing Orders also speak to disorderly conduct when you unnecessarily raise points of order. I want this debate to proceed. Proceed, Hon. Tongoyo.

Hon. Ali Wario Guyo.

Hon. Wario, why should some regions be entitled to billions of monies simply because the Budget and Appropriations Committee chose to meet there? Does it not distort the national Budget? Why should some regions get up to Ksh3 billion simply because the Budget and Appropriations Committee chose to go and...

Hon. Yussuf Mohammed. (Hon. James Nyikal spoke off the record) Hon. (Dr) Nyikal, you are very close to him. Why not let him present, and then you can make your contributions? Proceed.

I am not seeing Hon. Tom Odege in this House. Therefore, let us have Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal. For the avoidance of doubt, I go with the list of requests, except for exceptional cases.

No, he has not asked you to inform him. I doubt Hon. Nyikal would seek medical information from you. (Laughter)

You now notice the danger of allowing information.

We shall have Hon. Mutunga, Hon. David Mboni and Hon. Irene Mayaka in that order.

We have the Chair, Hon. Wamboka and Hon. Omboko. There is a distinction. (Hon. Wamboka retreated to his seat) Proceed, Hon. Mutunga.

Hon. David Mboni, followed by Hon. Irene Mayaka.

Hon. Irene Mayaka.

Hon. Joseph Emathe. Followed by Hon. Robert Basil.

Members, for the avoidance of doubt, we are here up to nine o'clock today, and we are barely six of us in the House. We shall all speak. We have up to nine o'clock.

Hon. Robert Basil, before you make your contribution, let me, on behalf of the Hon. Speaker, welcome professionals from Chesumei Constituency who are in the Public Gallery of the National Assembly to observe the debates. Feel welcome, and whatever you learn in terms of our engagements, take it home. We...

Hon. Kimani Kuria, then we will listen to contributions from Members on my left.

Hon. Kimani Kuria, it is always pleasant to listen to you on matters of finance. I wanted to pick your brain on the allocation for public participation. I do not know whether you thought about it. It is ring-fenced at Ksh3 billion.

Hon. Catherine Omanyo. You will be followed by the Chairperson of the Public Accounts Committee, followed by Hon. (Dr) Eve Obara because of gender considerations.

The Chairman of the Public Accounts Committee, Hon. Tindi Mwale.

Hon. (Dr) Eve Obara has been recognised.

Thank you, Hon. Makali Mulu. Hon. Benard Kitur.

I thought you were going to request for more time. You were just beginning to contribute. (Laughter)

Hon. Andrew Okuome, the Member of Parliament for Karachuonyo. Hon. Adipo Okuome (Karachuonyo, ODM) : Thank you for this opportunity to contribute to this Bill. First, I support the Bill. My support is with some questions and concerns that I would like governors to address. I know they are doing...

I thought in terms of Clause 6 here, you needed first and foremost, to provide that Kenya Revenue Authority shall establish revenue collection systems for all counties before you say, it may be a collecting agent for the counties. For purposes of collection, we have a single system across the...

Thank you. Hon. Canon Naomi Waqo, proceed.

Hon. (Dr) Eve Obara.

Hon. Joshua Kimilu.

Hon. Catherine Omanyo, Member of Parliament for Busia County.

Hon. Joseph Kahangara.

Hon. Timothy Toroitich.

Hon. Timothy Toroitich, you will have seven minutes the next time the House convenes to deliberate on this particular Bill. Let us be upstanding, Hon. Members. ADJOURNMENT Hon. Members, the time being 7.03

Hon. Nabii.

Hon. Dick Maungu.

Hon. Ferdinand Wanyonyi.

Hon. Samuel Atandi.

Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal.

When you see the scope of the gold belt from Migori through the lake to Homa Bay, through Nyamula in Uyoma and a bit of Seme, to Ikolomani—which is the corrupted name Shinali’s people use for a gold mine—there could be a gold belt there.

Hon. Joseph Oyula, the only Member who best understands money.

Hon. Naomi Waqo.

Hon. Geoffrey Mulanya Wakili.

Hon. Peter Francis Masara, do you want to speak to this?

Hon. Florence Jematiah.

The Member for Kitui Rural, Hon. David Mboni.

The Hon. Geoffrey Ruku.

Hon. Mutuse, were you on this side? (Hon. Mutuse spoke off the record) Okay. I thought you wanted to cross directly. If you intend to cross the Floor, you have to do the right thing.

Hon. John Waluke.

Hon. Stephen Mogaka.

The Chairperson, Departmental Committee on Education, Hon. Julius Melly.

Hon. George Gitonga Murugara.

Hon. Mary Emaase.

Hon. Jane Kagiri.

Hon. Patriot Eckomas Mutuse.

Thank you. Hon. Lillian Siyoi.

Hon. Augustine Mwafrika.

Proceed, Hon. Peter Lochakapong.

Verbatim text unavailable — read this contribution in the official Hansard.

The Mover to reply. Meanwhile, Hon. Peter Masara, approach the Chair.

Thank you, Hon. Shinali. The question on Second Reading will be put when this business will next be scheduled by the House Business Committee, for the convenience of the House. (Putting of the Question deferred) Next Order. THE NATIONAL POLICE SERVICE COMMISSION (AMENDMENT) BILL Mover.

Hon. Shinali.

Chairperson of the Departmental Committee on Administration and Internal Security, Hon. Gabriel Tongoyo.

Thank you, Chairperson. Hon. Geoffrey Mulanya.

Ring the Quorum Bell for ten minutes. (The Quorum Bell was rung) There appears to be no quorum. (The Quorum Bell was rung) ADJOURNMENT Hon. Members, be upstanding. Standing Order 35 (2) requires the Bell be rung for 10 minutes when the quorum call is made. If there is no...

Thank you for highlighting. I doubt we intended the Equalisation Fund to be more than the devolved funds allocation. Next is the Member for Kitui Rural Constituency.

Hon. Farah Maalim.

Thank you, Hon. Farah Maalim, for that informative contribution. Hon. Phylis Bartoo.

Thank you, Hon. Temporary Speaker. I am pleased that I am speaking after you spoke on this very important matter. Hon. Members, without repeating the words of Hon. Farah Maalim when he contributed to this Bill, let me say that this is not a Bill implementing Article 204 of the...

Yes.

Hon. Temporary Speaker, a lot has changed in terms of the road network. Hon. Murugara, I am saying that to emphasise the need for this Fund in some parts of the country. Of course, the Nithi side that faces Nyeri is very green and very populated, but the southern part...

Thank you Sir. I was just thinking that what has been happening to Kisii and the larger Nyanza region is due to political marginalisation and it is intended. I largely think it is due to budget distortions, which we could deal with in the context of the role given to...

Hon. Agnes Pareyio.

Thank you, Hon. Agnes Pareiyo. Hon. Bady Bady. Hon. Bady, you will be followed by Hon. Joseph Tonui for clarity

Hon. Members, I am told Parliament may today sit up to even past 9.00 p.m. Therefore, there is no hurry. Think through this matter. I will remind Members that this is not an ordinary Fund. Let us not seek to address the inequities in our budgeting distortion to be cured...

There is a point of information from Hon. Farah Maalim.

Hon. Farah Maalim, give Hon. Tonui the information you have.

The Member for Borabu, Hon. Osero.

Do you want to be informed by Hon. Farah Maalim?

Hon. Farah Maalim.

I wanted to give preference to our lady Members. Hon. Jessica, would you like to speak on this? Please do, because you have other national duties to engage in for the good of Kenyan society around this time.

The Member of Parliament for Mwea, do you want to speak on this? Should we go straight to Hon. Geoffrey Ruku? Hon. Gichimu Githinji will follow Hon. Geoffrey Ruku.

Hon. Gichimu Githinji. (Several Members rose their hands.) It is now time for Hon. Githinji.

I request you to read the whole of Article 260 (a) to (d) and use the ejusdem generis means of interpretation, looking at the kind of communities that come under the genres mentioned here. Further, tell us the kind of communities that could be included here. So I am giving...

You have already read Article 260 (a) . Kindly help the House with the reading of (b) , (c) , and (d) . If you read all of them, there is a thread running through the communities being spoken to, which would be useful to the House as we engage...

The useful intervention to benefit from your legal knowledge.

Hon. Farah, in as much as you are saying point of order, you would agree with Hon. Gichimu that if you were to talk about Tharaka Nithi County and send Equalisation Fund to be managed by the county, that money would go to the Nithi side, which may not be...

Thank you for the constitutional interpretation skills you have applied to Articles 204 and 260. I now want to give the chance to another great lawyer, Hon. Moses Kirima, who will be followed by a non-lawyer, Hon. Paul Biego.

Hon. Paul Biego.

Member for Mwea, what is out of order?

The Quorum Bell to be rung for 10 minutes as per the Standing Orders. (The Quorum Bell was rung) ADJOURNMENT Hon. Members, the time being 8.32

Thank you, Hon. Deputy Speaker. I hope my one minute is still there. I stand to support this Motion. I am one person who is under the leadership of the Rt. Hon. Raila Odinga. Let me confirm to the nation that he shared with me the intention to run for...

Member for Emuhaya.

Member for Mwingi West.

Hon. (Dr) James Nyikal.

Hon. David Gikaria.

Hon. Samuel Atandi.

Thank you, Hon. Samuel Atandi. Hon. Members, I only have 12 minutes. I do not know whether we still have time to speak for five minutes. Hon. Ferdinand Wanyonyi, procced.

The Member for Migori County, Hon. Fatuma.

Hon. Members, we only have seven minutes to go. Hon. (Dr) Lilian Gogo.

Hon. Githinji Gichimu.

We are talking about a patriotic matter where the substantive Speaker, whom I assist, will allow me to invoke the provisions of Standing Order 1 without being punished. Standing Order 1 is accordingly invoked to extend the time for debate on this Motion so that the interests shown are duly...

Hon. Joshua Mwalyo, you have the Floor.

Hon. (Dr) Eve Obara.

There is a Member who is looking very unhappy here. Would you give her the microphone to address the House on this? I cannot see her properly.

Mover, you may donate a bit of your time. (Loud consultations)

Next is Hon. John Waluke?

Hon. Sabina Chege.

Hon. Lang’at.

He won round two as well.

Hon. Kirima.

Mover.

Hon. Members, allow me to put the Question. (Question put and agreed to) That is a unanimous vote. This is the first time the House has passed a Motion in unanimity. Thank you, Hon. Members. Next Order. THE EQUALISATION FUND (ADMINISTRATION) BILL Mover.

Vice-Chairman, Hon. Lang’at, can you bow. We are way past time.

Hon. Members, the time being 7.10